Help With German Photos - Page 2

Gotthard Heinrici · 26-02-2008, 10:17 AM

It looks more like a Kriegsmarine Summer tunic, Paul.

CROONAERT · 26-02-2008, 10:27 AM

The cap laurels are wrong for kriegsmarine though. Looks like the dark green cap band and white piping of the infantry to me (and the "crush" of the cap is more akin to land units too).

dave. (plus there's no braiding on the peak)

Gotthard Heinrici · 26-02-2008, 11:07 AM

Did the Heer have white tunics though?

CROONAERT · 26-02-2008, 11:11 AM

Yes. So did the Luftwaffe and Waffen SS.

Dave.

Gotthard Heinrici · 26-02-2008, 11:35 AM

Thanks Dave. I shall bow to your superior knowledge on the subject

Slipdigit · 26-02-2008, 02:32 PM

I have a picture in a book (at home, of course) showing a Heer white jacket. Doubt my scanner is working (apply cobbler's children going barefoot analogy here), but I can give you book and page number. You'll probably be in bed before I can get it posted.

Seems like it was discontinued in 1938 or 39, but some wild Toms continued to wear them on into the war. I guess this is one of those wild Toms.

CROONAERT · 26-02-2008, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slipdigit

Seems like it was discontinued in 1938 or 39, but some wild Toms continued to wear them on into the war. I guess this is one of those wild Toms.

There were 3 different patterns of this tunic to be encountered in the Heer, the last of which the Weisser Rock fur Offiziere,neuerer Vorschrift was introduced in 1937. It never actually got discontinued and was worn until the end of the war (but orders stated that it was only to be worn between 1st April and 30th September and not in the field (it was intended as a walking out dress and for functions such as civil ceremonies ,mess functions and sports events, etc.)

Dave

von Poop · 26-02-2008, 03:05 PM

The Gun,
Based on the carriage I'm now pretty sure it's German.
3 possibilities so far:
28cm kurze Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn)
28cm Lange Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn)
28cm Schwere Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn)

Working from Gander's encyclopedia of German weapons (which includes captured types) I've no picture of the Lange/long, and the Schwere/heavy seems to have some sort of recuperator on top of the barrel/breech.
So as the barrel seems relatively short I lean towards the Kurze/short version for the moment.

28cm kurze Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn)
Designation: KzBrK(E)
Calibre: 283mm
Length of piece: 11200mm
Weight emplaced: 130,000 kg
Weight of piece: 45,300 kg
Traverse: 360 degrees
Elevation: 0-45 degrees
Muzzle velocity: 820 m/sec
Shell weight: 240 kg
Max range: 29,500 m
Rate of fire: 1 round every 5-6 min
Barrel life: 850 rounds
Manufacturers: Friedr. Krupp AG, Essen & Hanomag in Hannover.
Eight produced 1936-7.
(Small Arms, Artillery & Special Weapons of the Third Reich - Gander/Chamberlain.)

Gotthard Heinrici · 26-02-2008, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CROONAERT

There were 3 different patterns of this tunic to be encountered in the Heer, the last of which the Weisser Rock fur Offiziere,neuerer Vorschrift was introduced in 1937. It never actually got discontinued and was worn until the end of the war (but orders stated that it was only to be worn between 1st April and 30th September and not in the field (it was intended as a walking out dress and for functions such as civil ceremonies ,mess functions and sports events, etc.)

Dave

That would explain it so. Its unusual though to see it. well done Geoff and Dave!

Paul Reed · 26-02-2008, 03:58 PM

Thanks for all the info - very useful!

26-02-2008, 10:17 AM	#11 (permalink)
Gotthard Heinrici Ostfront is where its at! Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 3,468	It looks more like a Kriegsmarine Summer tunic, Paul. __________________ *"The Eastern front is like a house of cards. If the front is broken through at one point all the rest will collapse."* - General Heinz Guderian "With amazement and disappointment, we discovered in late October and early November that the beaten Russians seemed quite unaware that as a military force they had almost ceased to exist." - General Blumentritt "In all my years as a soldier, I have never seen me fight so hard." Lieutenant General Wilhelm Bittrich - Commander of II SS Panzer Korps - (Commenting on the British Paratroopers at Arnhem) - September 1944 "Had Clark given more heed to Juin's views...the savage battles of Cassino would probably never have been fought and the venerable house of St Benedict would have been unscathed" Rudolf Böhmler - 1st Fallschirmjäger Division - 1944 (After the bombing of Monte Cassino)

26-02-2008, 10:27 AM	#12 (permalink)
CROONAERT Vejovis Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 680	The cap laurels are wrong for kriegsmarine though. Looks like the dark green cap band and white piping of the infantry to me (and the "crush" of the cap is more akin to land units too). dave. (plus there's no braiding on the peak) __________________ In memory of 1440313 Gnr.Michael O'Mara, 155th Bty, 52nd (East Lancs) L.A.A.Regt (TA) R.A. - severely wounded near Arras in May 1940 and who took nearly 21 years to eventually die of his injuries. website: http://pathsofglory.co.uk

26-02-2008, 11:07 AM	#13 (permalink)
Gotthard Heinrici Ostfront is where its at! Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 3,468	Did the Heer have white tunics though? __________________ *"The Eastern front is like a house of cards. If the front is broken through at one point all the rest will collapse."* - General Heinz Guderian "With amazement and disappointment, we discovered in late October and early November that the beaten Russians seemed quite unaware that as a military force they had almost ceased to exist." - General Blumentritt "In all my years as a soldier, I have never seen me fight so hard." Lieutenant General Wilhelm Bittrich - Commander of II SS Panzer Korps - (Commenting on the British Paratroopers at Arnhem) - September 1944 "Had Clark given more heed to Juin's views...the savage battles of Cassino would probably never have been fought and the venerable house of St Benedict would have been unscathed" Rudolf Böhmler - 1st Fallschirmjäger Division - 1944 (After the bombing of Monte Cassino)

26-02-2008, 11:11 AM	#14 (permalink)
CROONAERT Vejovis Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 680	Yes. So did the Luftwaffe and Waffen SS. Dave. __________________ In memory of 1440313 Gnr.Michael O'Mara, 155th Bty, 52nd (East Lancs) L.A.A.Regt (TA) R.A. - severely wounded near Arras in May 1940 and who took nearly 21 years to eventually die of his injuries. website: http://pathsofglory.co.uk

26-02-2008, 11:35 AM	#15 (permalink)
Gotthard Heinrici Ostfront is where its at! Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 3,468	Thanks Dave. I shall bow to your superior knowledge on the subject __________________ *"The Eastern front is like a house of cards. If the front is broken through at one point all the rest will collapse."* - General Heinz Guderian "With amazement and disappointment, we discovered in late October and early November that the beaten Russians seemed quite unaware that as a military force they had almost ceased to exist." - General Blumentritt "In all my years as a soldier, I have never seen me fight so hard." Lieutenant General Wilhelm Bittrich - Commander of II SS Panzer Korps - (Commenting on the British Paratroopers at Arnhem) - September 1944 "Had Clark given more heed to Juin's views...the savage battles of Cassino would probably never have been fought and the venerable house of St Benedict would have been unscathed" Rudolf Böhmler - 1st Fallschirmjäger Division - 1944 (After the bombing of Monte Cassino)

26-02-2008, 02:32 PM	#16 (permalink)
Slipdigit The Dixie Division Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Not far enough in the woods Posts: 1,600	I have a picture in a book (at home, of course) showing a Heer white jacket. Doubt my scanner is working (apply cobbler's children going barefoot analogy here), but I can give you book and page number. You'll probably be in bed before I can get it posted. Seems like it was discontinued in 1938 or 39, but some wild Toms continued to wear them on into the war. I guess this is one of those wild Toms. __________________ Warmest Regards, Jeff The Bonnie Blue Flag *

26-02-2008, 03:05 PM	#18 (permalink)
von Poop I Like Tanks. Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Perfidious Albion. Posts: 7,617	The Gun, Based on the carriage I'm now pretty sure it's German. 3 possibilities so far: 28cm kurze Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn) 28cm Lange Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn) 28cm Schwere Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn) Working from Gander's encyclopedia of German weapons (which includes captured types) I've no picture of the Lange/long, and the Schwere/heavy seems to have some sort of recuperator on top of the barrel/breech. So as the barrel seems relatively short I lean towards the Kurze/short version for the moment. 28cm kurze Bruno Kanone (Eisenbahn) Designation: KzBrK(E) Calibre: 283mm Length of piece: 11200mm Weight emplaced: 130,000 kg Weight of piece: 45,300 kg Traverse: 360 degrees Elevation: 0-45 degrees Muzzle velocity: 820 m/sec Shell weight: 240 kg Max range: 29,500 m Rate of fire: 1 round every 5-6 min Barrel life: 850 rounds Manufacturers: Friedr. Krupp AG, Essen & Hanomag in Hannover. Eight produced 1936-7. (Small Arms, Artillery & Special Weapons of the Third Reich - Gander/Chamberlain.) __________________ It's only the Internet.

26-02-2008, 03:58 PM	#20 (permalink)
Paul Reed Ubique Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: UK/France Posts: 2,853	Thanks for all the info - very useful! __________________ The WW2 Society: Remembering those from Britain & The Commonwealth who served 1939-45 - http://www.battlefieldsww2.50megs.com/ww2_society.htm

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