Omaha beach

[von Poop]

Originally Posted by jimbotosome

Again, these are not valid arguments. First of all the Churchill got the living dog crap beat out of it at Dieppe. The Pak38s would have to shoot down or at the its tracks to kill a Churchill but they could not kill a Sherman from the front either. The Sherman was not made of aluminum. But a Pak50 would take out both Shermans and Churchills with ease. Churchills got the crap kicked out of them virtually everywhere they went. They didn’t have a reputation of being a formidable tank in WWII.

Just an aside as i'm reading a little tale of Churchills first combat use at Dieppe at the mo.
29 Churchills got Ashore,
15 got over the sea wall (debated figure apparently).
They were stopped by Concrete defences laid across the entrances to the town, the German AT gunners took severe casualties as they had enormous difficuilty penetrating the Churchills Rather substantial armour, The Churchill was actually quite a tough prospect for AT rounds, one in Africa took thirty-one 50mm hits and wasn't penetrated, another took four 50mm hits and two 75mm continuing to fight on with 'minor suspension damage' the Dieppe churchills suffered from a bad plan and the tragic failure of the Western assault to neutralise the Hindenberg Battery or the Headlands leaving the main beach a "well prepared killing field" rather than any of their actual design failings (Infantry Tank Concept. Too slow and undergunned..though one that got into town did considerable damage with her 3" Howitzer) The armour and cross country ability of the Churchill was actually very good for the time.

[Paul Reed]

I have just finished transcribing the War Diary of an RTR unit equipped with Churchill's that served in Normandy; the diary clearly shows the vehicle stood up to heavy punishment, and did not brew up quickly, giving the crew time to escape. The unit took on Panther's with the tank in the fighting near Fontenay le Pesnil and scored several KOs.

[Aerofalcon14]

The strategy on D-day was primarily concentrated around tanks, including DD tanks( amphibious tanks) unlike other beaches, where most of the tanks made it ashore, many of the tanks attached to the invasion force on omaha beach sunk before they ever touched the beach. the reason for this is largely attributed to these tanks traveling parallel to the waves rather than against them, causing them to be swamped, p( since DD tanks are largely unreliable to any but the calmest of ocean conditions

[plant-pilot]

Originally Posted by Aerofalcon14

The strategy on D-day was primarily concentrated around tanks, including DD tanks( amphibious tanks) unlike other beaches, where most of the tanks made it ashore, many of the tanks attached to the invasion force on omaha beach sunk before they ever touched the beach. the reason for this is largely attributed to these tanks traveling parallel to the waves rather than against them, causing them to be swamped, p( since DD tanks are largely unreliable to any but the calmest of ocean conditions

May I be pedantic as an Amphibious Engineer? The shores of Normandy are subject to coastal conditions, not ocean conditions.


But the point that DD tanks were only really designed for the calmest of conditions is a valid one.

[von Poop]

And as pedantry is the order of the day I'd just like to add that launching them too far out was the primary cause, leading to the symptom of attempting to swim in unsuitable conditions and hitting the waves wrongly..

Hello aerofalcon.
It's quite strange here.
Hope you enjoy it. (despite all the pedantry)

[morse1001]

The most important reason for the loss of the 27 DD was due to the fact that their training was done under calm fresh water conditions. Not once, did they train at sea.

the Col in charge made the DDs turns so that they were broadside to the waves. The waves came over the canvas contraptions.

Originally Posted by morse1001

The most important reason for the loss of the 27 DD was due to the fact that their training was done under calm fresh water conditions. Not once, did they train at sea.

the Col in charge made the DDs turns so that they were broadside to the waves. The waves came over the canvas contraptions.

Morse, are you saying it was inexperience alone? I have always heard it was simply not designed for that kind of wave disturbance.