Jewish aircrew

[adamcotton]

It's my understanding that Jewish servicemen were treated by the Nazis in exactly the same way as Jews all over Europe - it didn't matter whether they were German Jews or not (who, incidentally, had their German citizenship revoked by the Nazis). On the subject of circumcision, it was - and is - common practice for American boys to be circumcised at birth, regardless of their religon, so it could never be used as a determining factor in the treatment meted out.

[Kiwiwriter]

Originally Posted by lancesergeant

Agree with you on the circumcision question. It would be up to the individual parents concerned and some children were circumcised on health /medical grounds. My comment is that of the logic in Adams article where a non - Jew was taken away due to his being circumcised. The logic implied here by them, "he's circumcised, he must be jewish".

Good point about the dog tags, I can see where you're coming from with the point about not having them could mean not being able to prove pow status. My comment is reflected in the comment that the Germans saw the H on the dog tag marking them out as Jewish. It would be interesting to see if numbers of men who had the H on their dogtags disappeared on Nacht und Nebel as you put it. Maybe the reason those who were led away kept their tags is like you say not otherwise being able to prove pow status, but saying that do they weigh it up by disposing of the potential incriminating h embossed tag.

Something must have filtered through for this soldier to ditch his tag. Were cases of atrocities to Jews getting through to the pows.

I don't think the Jews of Britain, Canada, and America needed to hear about cases of atrocities before they became POWs...while the Holocaust was still mostly secret, the Nazis had made no secret of their anti-Semitism, and Kristallnacht, concentration camps, and Nazi anti-Semitic brutality was well-known. Jews who had fled Hitler told their harrowing tales to relatives when they reached their safe havens. So Jews going in the military, before they got captured, knew it was not wise to get captured.

I would say Americans felt the same way about being caught by the Japanese, for different reasons.

[Kitty]

I am sure I have read somewhere that RAF aircrew and British Army & Navy used to replace the Jewish religion on all dogtags and official documents with Roman Catholic if there was the chance the Jew would fall into enemy hands. ie. if he was on the front line or flying over enemy held territory.
I'd quite like to know if this were true.

[von Poop]

Originally Posted by mosquito617

I am sure I have read somewhere that RAF aircrew and British Army & Navy used to replace the Jewish religion on all dogtags and official documents with Roman Catholic if there was the chance the Jew would fall into enemy hands. ie. if he was on the front line or flying over enemy held territory.
I'd quite like to know if this were true.

Why not ask 'em?
Association of Jewish Ex-Servicemen:
http://www.ajex.org.uk/index.htm

[spidge]

Some interesting info here about Jewish participation.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/...w2/sugar1.html

Jewish RAF Special Operators in Radio Counter Measures with 101 Squadron

(September 1943–May 1945)

By Martin Sugarman

(Archivist, British Association of Jewish Ex-Servicemen and Women – AJEX - Jewish Military Museum, London)

[pisis]

First off, gentlemen, thanks so much for great links! This is something very useful, as I do research on Jewish soldiers in WW2 of Czechoslovakian origin since my 13 or so... Thanks! Useful!

I did quite a big project on "Jews in the Czechoslovakian Army in USSR". However, it is still not translated into English due to its 85 pages... And astill, I have to rework it and enhance with more Jewish vets' memoirs - http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/showpos...3&postcount=44


What I know from there concerning the Jewish POW's - but those who fought under Czechoslovakian Foreign Army in USSR - http://www.czechpatriots.com/csmu/ - where, when fell into captivity, all tortured and murdered...

There were also numerous people of Jewish origin fighting in the Czechoslovak army in Great Britian, Middle East and, of course, i RAF. To avoid them, getting caught by Germans, most of the Czechoslovakian Jews serving in RAF were forced to either serve as mechanic staff or do the administration or medical service...

[Gibbo]

I was browsing in a bookshop earlier today & looked at a book called POW: Allied Prisoners in Europe 1939-45 by Adrian Gilbert. By chance, I opened it at the section dealing with this subject. According to it, American & British Commonwealth Jews weren't treated differently from other POWs in Stalags, although there were claims that Jewish GIs were murdered after capture in the Battle of the Bulge. Some men concealed their faith but others didn't. Towards the end of the war the Germans tried to segregate Jewish POWs, but still in the same camps. Where the senior Allied officers protested vigorously at this measure the Germans backed down. In those camps where the Jews were segregated they weren't in fact treated any worse than their comrades. Throughout the war the Germans were apparently concerned over the potential for retaliation against their POWs held by the Western Allies.

Some Palestinian Jews serving in the British Labour Corps were captured on Crete. The British senior officers successfully protested any attempt to treat them differently, such as the refusal of Red Cross parcels. On one occasion, a Palestinian who died of illness was, on the insistence of the British senior officer, given a military funeral & buried in a grave marked by a Star of David.

The above refers, of course, to American & British Commonwealth Jews. The book says that Soviet Jews were, if they were lucky, shot on capture.

[Kyt]

Originally Posted by Gibbo

I was browsing in a bookshop earlier today & looked at a book called POW: Allied Prisoners in Europe 1939-45 by Adrian Gilbert.

I'm waiting for this book to arrive from my bookclub - is it as good as the blurb states?

[Gibbo]

Originally Posted by Kyt

I'm waiting for this book to arrive from my bookclub - is it as good as the blurb states?

I only spent 5 minutes browsing through it & didn't buy it as I've got too many unread books at the moment, with more likely to arrive on 25 December. It seemed to be comprehensive & to possess a rare combination of detailed research & readability.

[pisis]

Tell me, I have piles of unread books...