Hitler Youth In The Concentration Camps

[Harry Ree]

Originally Posted by jason taylor

Could he have been a Sonderkommando?

I would say not.This group was employed as the detail in extermination centres such as Auschwitz and other such centres in Poland to perform the gruesome tasks of handling the dead.

They were, in the majority of cases, selected for this type of work by the SS selection of those on the incoming transports.Others may have volunteered for this Hades task as a motivation to survive.However the SS randomly would clear out the Sonderkommdo groups to the extermination process without warning.

These inmates knew what was going on in these camps and we owe it to those who survived who were able to give firm evidence of the Nazi policy of deceivement in their "Settlement in the East" and its genocide on the day when retribution came.

[BulgarianSoldier]

Originally Posted by Gibbo

The first picture is from an article in the Daily Mail, a British newspaper. It's about a book on Alex Kurzem, a Jewish boy who was adopted by an SS unit as their mascot; they thought that he was a Russian orphan. He's still alive in Australia. Here's a link to the full story.

Hitler's SS mascot was Jewish | the Daily Mail

I think that the white uniform is a summer uniform.

Are you sure that the man in the last photo is SS? The site linked below says that army panzer troops wore the Totenkopf (Death's Head) collar patches.

Heer black Panzer uniform

Interesting, theres was 3.SS Panzer Division Totenkopf, he can be from that devision there are 2 tank regiments in 3 SS Panzer Devision, one is 3.SS Panzer Regiment, and the other is 3.SS Tank Destroyer(panzerjager) Detachment
Im sure the white uniform isn't summer uniform, man i can see someone wearing such a uniform from a lot of distance, great target.
Thanks about the info you gave me for the Hitler's SS mascot.

Dani

[laufer]

I can't see a single member of Hitlerjugend in this picture. They weren't wear black uniforms, but similar to those of SA.
Many formations use black uniforms. Ground units of Luftwaffe for example. They were present in many places in occupied Europe.

[von Poop]

Within the Hitler youth there were a few black uniforms in both the DJ & the HJ proper, perhaps more among the younger DJ members if memory serves.
I'm still not convinced there's a member in that photograph though.

Nice little primer page here:
Hitler Youth Uniforms

Cheers,
Adam.

[Gibbo]

The link below is to a militaria dealer's website. They've got an original Wehrmacht artillery major's white summer jacket for sale for a mere EUR 820. I agree that such a garment would not have been worn in range of the enemy.

Original WW2 German militaria, WW2 Red Army militaria, WW2 Soviet militaria and more...

[richcarrick]

thanks for the info on the SS Mascot - I will definitely check out that book. Speaking of books, I often read the Sven Hassel war stories, and I do recall mention of HJ training - a Leutnant has been imprisoned for cowardice - his son is to be taken and educated by the state. To break his will, the Leutnant is informed of his son's progress and at one point is told (if I remember correctly) that he is 'doing well in hand to hand fighting with Jews - just wait until we give him a real person to kill!'
Remembering that the idea was to 'work towards' Hitler's ideals, I don't think it's beyond the realms of probability that HJ leaders used their own initiative when training HJ members - so witnessing executions would be one way of 'hardening' them to their task.
Also - couldn't and didn't some HJ members have honorary SS rank? The SS was a voluntary service, and the people in the picture could be on secondment to an Einsatsgruppen unit, or visiting a camp at their own request...

pretty far out observations I know, but any truth in them?

[plant-pilot]

Originally Posted by richcarrick

thanks for the info on the SS Mascot - I will definitely check out that book. Speaking of books, I often read the Sven Hassel war stories, and I do recall mention of HJ training - a Leutnant has been imprisoned for cowardice - his son is to be taken and educated by the state. To break his will, the Leutnant is informed of his son's progress and at one point is told (if I remember correctly) that he is 'doing well in hand to hand fighting with Jews - just wait until we give him a real person to kill!'
Remembering that the idea was to 'work towards' Hitler's ideals, I don't think it's beyond the realms of probability that HJ leaders used their own initiative when training HJ members - so witnessing executions would be one way of 'hardening' them to their task.

Just a couple of points.

Please remember that the works of Sven Hassel are works of fiction, not a historic record of the period.

Allowing what are kids to see executions as a method of 'hardening them up' would be as counter productive as it would anything else. It may work for some, but they are more likely to be the ones pre-disposed to accepting those horrors anyway. Many others would be sickened by the spectacle and likely to fall apart before action having seen and been sickened by the sight and smell of people being slaughtered before. They would be acutely aware of the fragility of the human body on contact with a rifle round..... and before your first action it is your belief that you are going to survive that gives you the mettle to actually go through with it.

Before their first experience of combat everyone is scared by the uncertainty of how they will react to the sights, sounds and smells but once it starts there is little time to worry about it. Afterwards you are still haunted by them, but at least have the small comfort that it was a case of survival.... them or you. That is not something you can use as a 'shield' when you have witnessed them lined up and needlessly shot..... even if you do believe in the politics.

I think this method of 'hardening' would have created as many terrified liabilities as it would keen killers.

[Zimber]

Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 7


FIFTY-NINTH DAY

Thursday, 14 February 1946
Morning Session


For the education of adolescents, the German fascists created a special organization, the so-called Hitler Youth (Hitlerjugend). The Defendant Baldur von Schirach was for quite a long time the head of this organization.
What kind of methods were used for the education of German youth by the fascist criminals is described by a French subject, Ida Vasso, the directress of a hostel for aged Frenchmen in Lvov. During the German occupation of Lvov, she had an opportunity of visiting the Lvov ghetto. In her statement to the Extraordinary State Commission, Vasso described the local system for the extermination of human beings.
From Vasso's statement it is obvious that the Germans educated the Hitler Youth by training these young fascists to shoot at living targets-at children specially handed over to the Hitler Youth to serve as targets.


I now quote from Vasso's statement in this connection. It is included in the text of the report as a certified document, on Page 6-c of the document book. The Tribunal win find Vasso's statement on the reverse side of Page 59, Paragraph 5, beginning from Line 14 from the beginning of the paragraph:
". . . the little children were martyrs. They were handed over to the Hitler Youth who used them as living targets while learning how to shoot. No mercy for others, all for themselves- this was the motto of the Germans. The whole world must learn of their methods. We, who were the helpless witnesses of these revolting scenes, must speak of those horrors in order that everybody should know of them and, what is more important, should never forget them since no vengeance will ever bring the minions of dead back to life again."

The Avalon Project : Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 7

I also remember watching a documentary where a British tank commander shot Three Hitler Youth members who were shooting people in the genital area because they were running to greet their liberators.

[4th wilts]

in an org as big as the ss everybody must have known about these pig-dogs,yet the old chaps still deny ever seeing or hearing of these attrocities;i was in the waffen ss you see.b######s.no wonder my old mate still hates these scum.yours,4th wilts.

[chipmunk wallah]

Can we look at the biger picture please? Instead of getting bogged down in the specifics of one particular photograph...
All,Germanys occupying forces were involved in the final solution and plain murder. It is recorded fact that Volks Dtch and there odious HJ off spring regularly went on "jew hunting"trips in the General Government .The acounts from ocupied Warsaw alone could fill many books. Boys in HJ uniforms regularly attached themselves to various police units on these occasions and,as teenagers ,were often the nastiest and most immoral of the bunch.
Just to parralel,I always say,if Im going to end up getting mugged on the street my preference would be an adult does it as by and large teens dont have regard for consiciences of their actions.