Valentine Tank - friend or foe

[Kieron Hill]

Hi Guys

Interesting photo of a Valentine tank, its
been captured by the Germans and then
knocked out by Allies somewhere in North
Africa. Anyone got any ideas with regards
the Div/Unit sign on the side of the turret
it looks to me to be a Lion. Any ideas?

Enjoy
Kieron

[von Poop]

Valentine Mk.III. (Edit: or 5?, impossible to say without seeing the engine?).
The Bison was the symbol of Pz.Rgt.7 part of the 10th Panzer Division. I've only got reference for it facing the other way, but that doesn't usually mean anything.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Kieron Hill]

Panzer-Regiment 7 (7th Panzer Regiment)

The 7th Panzer Regiment at times appears to have displayed an "outer sprayed" Bison symbol. Most renowned evidence of this is a captured British Valentine with a "white edged" Bison appearing on the rear turret bustle sides. It has also been seen "black edged" on the rear of a PzKpfw.II. Any other sighting in Africa would be welcomed.

Hi Guys

Found this info on a site dedicated to Panzer tank divisions
I am now guessing this could be one of those WW2 press released
photos, as another person has told me this appears in a book.

Any ideas of the book? he also said it was taken in Tunisia 1943

Cheers
Kieron

[Kieron Hill]

The Buffalo

The 7th Panzer Regiment chose the buffalo, (actually the "wisent", a European Bison) as their regimental insignia, and painted it on their tanks and vehicles. they also commissioned a sculptor to chisel a seven foot high statue of a buffalo from white granite, and it was erected in late 1938 on a pedestal near the present flagpoles. The Statue survived the Allied air attacks with little damage. When the Americans arrived they found the buffalo in place, the last member of the 7th Panzer Regiment in the Kaserne.
Just what happened to the buffalo is covered with the dust of history. An officer of the 346th Engineer Regiment recalls that it was removed from the pedestal and pushed by a bulldozer into a nearby bomb crater, but he no longer remembers where the crater was. Mr. Heinrich Elsaesser, who worked in the Kaserne, clearly recalls seeing the buffalo daily during 1946 as it lay at the bottom if a trash dump in a ravine behind what is now Building 2401, Weicht Village.
Former members of the 7th Panzer Regiment would like to return the statue to the 363rd Panzer Battalion, near Wuerzburg, which now bears the colors of the old 7th. Meanwhile, the memory of the buffalo is kept alive at Patch Barracks by the Post Headquarters, which uses a buffalo silhouette as its symbol, and by several Patch athletic teams that bear its name.

Hi Guys, me again

It surprises me what you can find with a little
help

Cheers
Kieron

[von Poop]

The picture's a crop from this more general view Kieron:
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/mk3_ger.jpg

[Kieron Hill]

Cheers just found the same picture, but
looking at my picture its taken from a
different angle. mine has got people in the
background and the horizan is different.
I guess if everyone is using the same
road pictures are bound to be duplicated.

Interesting figures from that website
of captured vehicles/tanks used by
axis forces

• 200 - armored cars
• 300 - halftracked vehicles
• 400 - armored halftracked vehicles
• 600 - fully-tracked artillery tractors
• 630 - armored artillery tractors
• 700 - tanks
• 800 - gun carriers / self-propelled guns

Cheers Kieron

[von Poop]

So it is

Bit of a thread on Beutepanzer here:
http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/weapons...n-firefly.html

That Russian site on them is well worth a shufti, they have a nice page on captured Valentines here:
Infantry "Valentine"

[4th wilts]

i have a book about the british 7th armd div,with the same photo in it.i also have a book about the 3rd u.s army,same author,i cant remember the authors name however.according to the 7th a/d book,they knocked it out,that i do remember.lee

[Bodston]

Originally Posted by von Poop

The picture's a crop from this more general view Kieron:
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/mk3_ger.jpg

This shot also appears in 'The Valentine in North Africa 1942-43' by Brian Perrett, where it is credited to the IWM archive. It is NA 844 and their caption reads

THE BRITISH ARMY IN TUNISIA 1943
A Valentine tank of 'A' Squadron, 17/21st Lancers which was captured by the Germans in November 1942 and used by them until it was knocked out, 24 February 1943.

[Kieron Hill]

Whats that old cliche a picture can tell a thousand
tales...well how true.

thanks again all

regards
Kieron