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Old 14-09-2005, 04:06 PM   #1 (permalink)
spidge
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Meant to post this yesterday on the 65th anniversary of the Italians move into Egypt 13/9/1940.

They initially moved 5 divisions and 200 odd tanks against a much smaller force and yet 3 months later there wasn't an Italian still on Egyptian soil except for prisoners

The 6th division, my Fathers outfit, belted them at Bardia and took 45,000 prisoners for the loss of 500 which was a low number as long as you weren't one of them.

Tobruk was next with another 25,000 prisoners for the loss of 450 British & Aussies.

Australians then capture Derna & Benghazi in quick succession then 25,000 retreating Italians surrender to 3,000 British.

Anthony Eden makes a speech parodying Winston Churchill's famous 'Battle of Britain' speech. He says "Never has so much been surrendered, by so many, to so few".

150,000+ prisoners / 400+ tanks / 700+ Artillery pieces.

Where did it all go wrong for the Italians?

Look forward to a few interesting posts.
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My Avatar is the memorial to the 22 Commonwealth Coastwatchers at the Temakin Cemetery on Betio (Tarawa Atoll) who were beheaded by the Japanese on 15th October 1942. http://www.dva.gov.au/media/publicat...mem_beito.html

"You were given the choice between war and dishonor.
You chose dishonor and you will have war."

(Winston Churchill made this prophetic pronouncement in a House of Commons speech in 1938, just after Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain signed the Munich agreement with Hitler. Chamberlain returned from Germany with the signed agreement in hand, proclaiming that "peace in our time" had been achieved. Churchill attacked Chamberlain's "politics of appeasement" in this and many other speeches.)

What did the Australians do in ww2 and other conflicts? Check out this site:
http://www.diggerhistory.info/00-pag...ster-index.htm
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Old 15-09-2005, 02:06 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I wrote an article on this campaign for "Europa Magazine," which is put out by GR/D games with their wargames, and it's on MagWeb. That will give a lot of background. I can't recall the website URL. I'll try to find it.
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"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender." -- Winston Churchill.

"I am not a hero. The heroes are all dead. I am a survivor." -- Sgt. William Guarnere, Easy Company, 506th Parachute Regiment, 101st Airborne Division.

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Old 15-09-2005, 02:22 PM   #3 (permalink)
spidge
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kiwiwriter@Sep 15 2005, 11:06 PM
I wrote an article on this campaign for "Europa Magazine," which is put out by GR/D games with their wargames, and it's on MagWeb. That will give a lot of background. I can't recall the website URL. I'll try to find it.

Thanks David.

Found it at: http://www.magweb.com/sample/seuropa/seu55daw.htm
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Spidge,

-------------------------------------------------------
My Avatar is the memorial to the 22 Commonwealth Coastwatchers at the Temakin Cemetery on Betio (Tarawa Atoll) who were beheaded by the Japanese on 15th October 1942. http://www.dva.gov.au/media/publicat...mem_beito.html

"You were given the choice between war and dishonor.
You chose dishonor and you will have war."

(Winston Churchill made this prophetic pronouncement in a House of Commons speech in 1938, just after Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain signed the Munich agreement with Hitler. Chamberlain returned from Germany with the signed agreement in hand, proclaiming that "peace in our time" had been achieved. Churchill attacked Chamberlain's "politics of appeasement" in this and many other speeches.)

What did the Australians do in ww2 and other conflicts? Check out this site:
http://www.diggerhistory.info/00-pag...ster-index.htm
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Old 15-09-2005, 02:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Post

Quote:
Originally posted by spidge+Sep 15 2005, 09:22 AM-->
Quote:
(spidge @ Sep 15 2005, 09:22 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Kiwiwriter
Quote:
@Sep 15 2005, 11:06 PM
I wrote an article on this campaign for "Europa Magazine," which is put out by GR/D games with their wargames, and it's on MagWeb. That will give a lot of background. I can't recall the website URL. I'll try to find it.X

Thanks David.

Found it at: http://www.magweb.com/sample/seuropa/seu55daw.htm
[/b]
Oh, great. I can't remember where the damn thing is...let me know what you think of it.
__________________
"My intensity is intense." -- Roger Clemens

"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender." -- Winston Churchill.

"I am not a hero. The heroes are all dead. I am a survivor." -- Sgt. William Guarnere, Easy Company, 506th Parachute Regiment, 101st Airborne Division.

Check out my little contributions to World War II history at my web pages:

World War II Plus 55

or

http://davidhlippman.wildbillguarnere.com
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Old 15-09-2005, 03:59 PM   #5 (permalink)
spidge
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kiwiwriter+Sep 15 2005, 11:56 PM-->
Quote:
(Kiwiwriter @ Sep 15 2005, 11:56 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>
Quote:
Originally posted by spidge@Sep 15 2005, 09:22 AM
<!--QuoteBegin-Kiwiwriter
Quote:
Quote:
@Sep 15 2005, 11:06 PM
I wrote an article on this campaign for "Europa Magazine," which is put out by GR/D games with their wargames, and it's on MagWeb. That will give a lot of background. I can't recall the website URL. I'll try to find it.X



Thanks David.

Found it at: http://www.magweb.com/sample/seuropa/seu55daw.htm
Oh, great. I can't remember where the damn thing is...let me know what you think of it.
[/b]
Great descriptive and in depth narrative David.

I have printed it off for Mum to read.

Dad was 6th Div / 19th Brigade / 2/8th. What a baptism of fire for them with an historical victory. It was fate that he was hit by a mortar and didn't get to Greece.

Six months later after hospitalisation in Egypt, he was home to the Heidelberg Repatriation Hospital in Victoria for another 3 months. He retired after 30 years at the Reserve Bank of Australia and passed away in 1982.
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Spidge,

-------------------------------------------------------
My Avatar is the memorial to the 22 Commonwealth Coastwatchers at the Temakin Cemetery on Betio (Tarawa Atoll) who were beheaded by the Japanese on 15th October 1942. http://www.dva.gov.au/media/publicat...mem_beito.html

"You were given the choice between war and dishonor.
You chose dishonor and you will have war."

(Winston Churchill made this prophetic pronouncement in a House of Commons speech in 1938, just after Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain signed the Munich agreement with Hitler. Chamberlain returned from Germany with the signed agreement in hand, proclaiming that "peace in our time" had been achieved. Churchill attacked Chamberlain's "politics of appeasement" in this and many other speeches.)

What did the Australians do in ww2 and other conflicts? Check out this site:
http://www.diggerhistory.info/00-pag...ster-index.htm
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Old 15-09-2005, 04:22 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by spidge+Sep 15 2005, 10:59 AM-->
Quote:
(spidge @ Sep 15 2005, 10:59 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>
Quote:
Originally posted by Kiwiwriter@Sep 15 2005, 11:56 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by spidge@Sep 15 2005, 09:22 AM
<!--QuoteBegin-Kiwiwriter
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
@Sep 15 2005, 11:06 PM
I wrote an article on this campaign for "Europa Magazine," which is put out by GR/D games with their wargames, and it's on MagWeb. That will give a lot of background. I can't recall the website URL. I'll try to find it.X



Thanks David.

Found it at: http://www.magweb.com/sample/seuropa/seu55daw.htm


Oh, great. I can't remember where the damn thing is...let me know what you think of it.
Great descriptive and in depth narrative David.

I have printed it off for Mum to read.

Dad was 6th Div / 19th Brigade / 2/8th. What a baptism of fire for them with an historical victory. It was fate that he was hit by a mortar and didn't get to Greece.

Six months later after hospitalisation in Egypt, he was home to the Heidelberg Repatriation Hospital in Victoria for another 3 months. He retired after 30 years at the Reserve Bank of Australia and passed away in 1982.
[/b]
Thanks for that note.

And thank you for your father's service to Crown and Country. He was lucky in the long run...6th Division took a pounding in Greece and Crete, and he might have been killed. I'm glad he got to live a long and happy life in peace.
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"My intensity is intense." -- Roger Clemens

"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender." -- Winston Churchill.

"I am not a hero. The heroes are all dead. I am a survivor." -- Sgt. William Guarnere, Easy Company, 506th Parachute Regiment, 101st Airborne Division.

Check out my little contributions to World War II history at my web pages:

World War II Plus 55

or

http://davidhlippman.wildbillguarnere.com
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Old 15-09-2005, 05:06 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Yes, very good read, a good in depth and informative account of the campaign, I enjoyed reading it. It has increased my knowledge of the campaign a lot.
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Old 15-09-2005, 07:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Excellent article David, I think Gen. Richard O'Connor is one of the most underrated generals in history. If not for his capture in North Africa in 1941, it's possible he would have been the one to lead the British in Western Europe 1944-45.

An account I have of the Nibeiwa battle has General Malleti taking a main cannon round in the chest, don't know if that's true or not.

The Australians gave great service in the deserts of North Africa spidge, the Allies were lucky to have such fine soldiers. One of my moms' uncles was in the U.S. Army on New Guinea during WW II and I imagine he served alongside Australians.
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Old 19-09-2005, 05:32 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dac@Sep 15 2005, 02:55 PM
Excellent article David, I think Gen. Richard O'Connor is one of the most underrated generals in history. If not for his capture in North Africa in 1941, it's possible he would have been the one to lead the British in Western Europe 1944-45.

An account I have of the Nibeiwa battle has General Malleti taking a main cannon round in the chest, don't know if that's true or not.

The Australians gave great service in the deserts of North Africa spidge, the Allies were lucky to have such fine soldiers. One of my moms' uncles was in the U.S. Army on New Guinea during WW II and I imagine he served alongside Australians.
Thanks for the note...I agree about O'Connor...he should not have been sent to relieve Neame in mid-battle. His loss was devastating to the British. I think if he had not been captured, Crusader would not have misfired, and Gazala would not have been such an appalling mess.

Maletti was killed at Nibeiwa, alongside his son, but whether from a cannon shot or a bullet, I don't recall. I have it in my article.

The Australians were an elite force. I am glad that the British recently unveiled a memorial to them in London. And I know ANZAC Day is pretty big in London, with a parade.
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"My intensity is intense." -- Roger Clemens

"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender." -- Winston Churchill.

"I am not a hero. The heroes are all dead. I am a survivor." -- Sgt. William Guarnere, Easy Company, 506th Parachute Regiment, 101st Airborne Division.

Check out my little contributions to World War II history at my web pages:

World War II Plus 55

or

http://davidhlippman.wildbillguarnere.com
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Old 19-09-2005, 05:55 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dac@Sep 15 2005, 06:55 PM
Excellent article David, I think Gen. Richard O'Connor is one of the most underrated generals in history. If not for his capture in North Africa in 1941, it's possible he would have been the one to lead the British in Western Europe 1944-45.
But he did manage to escape and was well enough regarded to be given command of VIII Corps.
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