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Old 01-03-2008, 06:14 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by sapper View Post
I have several somewhere in the house. Piled up in amongst a load of WW2 junk and papers. being the pile is a foot high..I'm not going to look.
Sapper
Ah you tease Sapper But if ever one day you have a sort through that pile I'd be interested to know what you have. Presumably these are German leaflets dropped on the western front ('44-'45)?

The German leaflets generally have rather good graphics and are well designed from a visual point of view, but not very effective from a psychological point of view. Most Allied veterans I've spoken to, generally found them laughable but did tend to hang on to the more naughty ones.

I'd be interested to hear what you thought of them Sapper?

(Incidentally my grandfather was a Sapper as well, 225 Fld Co RE but in BEF, North Africa, Italy and Greece.)

Lee
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Old 01-03-2008, 06:25 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Philip,ABRG View Post
Lee is there a book with more info about the British leaflets?
If they are British leaflets for Germany then yes. The books by German author Klaus Kirchner are the ones to see. (Leaflet (Artikel))

The books are all in German but they illustrate every British leaflet dropped on Germany by UK-based aircraft. The are beautifully produced books and very cheap as well. It's the postage that is the killer though as these are over A4 size books with hundreds of pages.

There's a book by the late Jan de Groot for Allied leaflets dropped on the Netherlands:
De Wervelwind, De Vliegende Hollander: en andere uit de lucht verspreide vlugschriften; de Vries, Leonard/de Groot, Jan; (Skarabee Facsimile, 1974) ISBN 90 6071 133 5
But you might have a job finding it as it's quite rare. Most of the Allied leaflets dropped on Holland are illustrated in B&W only.

I had thought of doing some books myself but decided on concentrating on the leaflet database instead because of the sheer volume of leaflets and the time involved.

Eventually I want to have an illustration of every leaflet, with an English translation and with full dissemination data - but this will take me a lifetime to complete!
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Old 01-03-2008, 06:27 PM   #13 (permalink)
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The PsyWar Society also published catalogues (Blatters we call them) of propaganda leaflets. Mainly a textual list with a few illustrations. All our old stocks are now sold out but I'm thinking of putting together a mega issue for our 50th anniversary this year.
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Old 01-03-2008, 06:37 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Oke thanks for that link, were the leaflets in the artillery shells, the same that were used to drop by planes?
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Old 01-03-2008, 07:11 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Philip,ABRG View Post
Oke thanks for that link, were the leaflets in the artillery shells, the same that were used to drop by planes?
Good question! Yes and no, generally no.

This needs a long answer about the organisation of the various propaganda agencies.

The main British PsyWar organisation was called the Political Warfare Executive (PWE). This was one of the secret Government civilian agencies (like SIS, MI5, MI9, etc). PWE was based in the UK. Their London offices were at the BBC's Bush House (on the Strand). But they mainly worked in and around the Woburn Abbey area. Leaflets were designed there and printed at the large printers based at Watford, Luton and London. These leaflets when then dropped over Europe by UK-based bombers of RAF Bomber Command and the USAAF.

The US equivalent organisation was called the Office of War Information (OWI). They shared PWE's printers and dissemination facilities.

Then there was the Psychological Warfare Division of SHAEF (PWD/SHAEF). This was a military organisation under Eisenhower and was staffed with people from PWE and OWI as well as regular military personnel. After D-day they increasing took over the work of PWE and OWI and were responsible for the leaflets with code numbers ZG, WG, XG and others. These continued to be printed in the UK and dropped by UK-based aircraft.

However, they also had field units attached to each of the Armies. These units had mobile printing facilities and disseminated their leaflets by artillery shells. 21st Army Group field unit produced leaflets with the AgG code number for example. They also used printers in liberated Europe.

So most of the artillery fired leaflets were produced locally by the field units. However, some of the UK printed and disseminated leaflets were sent to Europe for dissemination by artillery as well. Often these were printed in a smaller size especially for artillery dissemination - they have the letter "A" at the end of the code number.

For example leaflet ZG.61 was printed in the UK on behalf of PWD/SHAEF and dropped by UK-based aircraft.
ZG.61K was the same leaflet but printed by PWD/SHAEF in Paris and disseminated either by artillery or TAF aircraft.
ZG.61A was printed in the UK but in a smaller size and sent to Europe for dissemination by artillery field units.
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Old 01-03-2008, 11:45 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Lee

Unless I missed something , I didn't notice any mention of "Behind Enemy Lines with Allied/Axis Propaganda by Edward Boehm" , a copy of which is sitting on my desk at the moment.
How do you rate that one ?

Regards

Ron

ps
Sorry I can't get the whole book cover into my scanner
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File Type: jpg Behind Enemy Lines.JPG (86.4 KB, 2 views)
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I was "Called-up" in Oct 1942
Served as a Wireless-Op with the 49th LAA (78 Div) from Apr 1943 to Dec 1944 (North Africa,Sicily,Italy, Egypt).
The Regiment was disbanded in Dec 1944 and I was retrained (in Italy) by the Royal Armoured Corps.
Served as a Loader-Op with the 4th QOH from Mar 1945 to Jan 1946 (Italy, Austria, Germany)
Finished up as Tech Cpl for "A" Sqdrn.

I was "De-mobbed" in Apr 1947

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Old 02-03-2008, 01:01 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Hi Ron,

Yes Boehm's book is excellent. It is beautifully illustrated in full-colour of very many German leaflets dropped on Allied troops in Italy.
And what's even better it can be picked up fairly cheaply on the second-hand book market (e.g. abebooks.com).

The only reason I didn't mention it above, was because Philip was looking for leaflets going the other way Britain to German troops rather than vice versa.

I have a PSYOP Bibliography listed on my website here:
PsyWar Bibliography by Lee Richards, (c) 2008

Ron, out of interest, did you ever listen to the "Jerry Front" radio station when you were in Italy? It was often advertised on the German leaflets and was wondering what it was like and if there was much tuning-in by Allied soldiers. For instance was there a lot of contemporary music or was it mainly the Lord Haw-haw type of drivel?

All the best,

Lee

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Goldstein View Post
Lee

Unless I missed something , I didn't notice any mention of "Behind Enemy Lines with Allied/Axis Propaganda by Edward Boehm" , a copy of which is sitting on my desk at the moment.
How do you rate that one ?

Regards

Ron

ps
Sorry I can't get the whole book cover into my scanner
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:46 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Lee

I should have known that you would have a copy and that you would recommend it

With regards to;
"Ron, out of interest, did you ever listen to the "Jerry Front" radio station when you were in Italy? It was often advertised on the German leaflets and was wondering what it was like and if there was much tuning-in by Allied soldiers. For instance was there a lot of contemporary music or was it mainly the Lord Haw-haw type of drivel?"

I'm afraid I was a young prim & proper wireless-op in those days who would never dream of going "off-net" to search for Jerry stations so I therefore can't speak with first hand experience.

When we were in the line the set would be manned right round the clock and the two frequencies that our 19 set used would be locked on permanently via the two large black dials shown below. That's not my old set but one that has been lovingly restored by a modern radio buff.

Once out of the line the 19 set would stay fixed in the back of the truck, still ready for use whenever required.
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If I am not for myself, then who will be for me?
And if I am only for myself, what am I?
And if not now, when?

Rabbi Hillel circa 30 BCE

I was "Called-up" in Oct 1942
Served as a Wireless-Op with the 49th LAA (78 Div) from Apr 1943 to Dec 1944 (North Africa,Sicily,Italy, Egypt).
The Regiment was disbanded in Dec 1944 and I was retrained (in Italy) by the Royal Armoured Corps.
Served as a Loader-Op with the 4th QOH from Mar 1945 to Jan 1946 (Italy, Austria, Germany)
Finished up as Tech Cpl for "A" Sqdrn.

I was "De-mobbed" in Apr 1947
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:33 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Ron, many thanks for the reply. Out of interest, do you remember if there was an official restrictions or orders preventing troops from collecting German leaflets or listening to the their propaganda broadcasts? I'm sure it wasn't encouraged, but was it just ignored as an irrelevance or was it forcibly forbidden, do you remember?

Germans troops and the civilian population were forbidden to read Allied leaflets or listen to radio broadcasts. If a soldier found a leaflet he had to write across it "Fiendpropaganda" (Enemy propaganda) and hand it in to an NCO. Civilians were given prison sentences for keeping leaflets or for spreading them around. Also Goebbels' propaganda ministry went to lengths to counter Allied propaganda and German soldiers were regularly lectured on the dangers of Britain's "dirty propaganda tricks".

But despite all that Allied leaflets were still collected and broadcasts listened to by the German Volk. The most popular radio station apparently was the British clandestine station called "Atlantik", later to become Soldatensender West. It had a lot of appeal because of the Jazz music and German marching songs (played by the Royal Marines band!). The news programme was mostly accurate but there was a lot of fabricated content, especially about the Nazi "Bonzen" - the corrupt high-ups of the Nazi Party - who were always knocked for getting out of military service, receiving extra "diplomatic" food rations, war-profiteering, not allowing air raid evacuees onto their large estates, etc.

I don't suppose there are any German veterans on here, but it would be interesting to chat with any German veterans who listened to Allied clandestine broadcasts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Goldstein View Post
Lee

I should have known that you would have a copy and that you would recommend it

With regards to;
"Ron, out of interest, did you ever listen to the "Jerry Front" radio station when you were in Italy? It was often advertised on the German leaflets and was wondering what it was like and if there was much tuning-in by Allied soldiers. For instance was there a lot of contemporary music or was it mainly the Lord Haw-haw type of drivel?"

I'm afraid I was a young prim & proper wireless-op in those days who would never dream of going "off-net" to search for Jerry stations so I therefore can't speak with first hand experience.

When we were in the line the set would be manned right round the clock and the two frequencies that our 19 set used would be locked on permanently via the two large black dials shown below. That's not my old set but one that has been lovingly restored by a modern radio buff.

Once out of the line the 19 set would stay fixed in the back of the truck, still ready for use whenever required.
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Old 03-03-2008, 07:08 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Out of interest, do you remember if there was an official restrictions or orders preventing troops from collecting German leaflets or listening to the their propaganda broadcasts? I'm sure it wasn't encouraged, but was it just ignored as an irrelevance or was it forcibly forbidden, do you remember ?
Lee

The one joy of threads such as this one is that it jolts one's memory

When we were "out of the line" the the Battery or Squadron office (usually a 3 Ton truck) used to have a notice board posted outside that gave Part 2 Orders. These were "local" orders issued by the Regimental hierarchy which would govern the conduct of "us" the rank & file.

I can not remember ever seing the type of restriction that you mention and I doubt if there was ever such an order given.

It might interest you to know that I can remember, as a young pre-conscript in my parent's home, occasionally hearing the horrible "whiney" tones of Lord Haw Haw (William Joyce). We listened on an ancient radio and we used to pick up the station simply by idly switching the tuning knob from side to side.

Again, there were no restrictions placed by the Government on "us" civilians for doing this and the wildly propagandist news from Germany was tempered by my dear mother's curses in Yiddish at this horrible man telling us about the evils that were about to be leashed on us.
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If I am not for myself, then who will be for me?
And if I am only for myself, what am I?
And if not now, when?

Rabbi Hillel circa 30 BCE

I was "Called-up" in Oct 1942
Served as a Wireless-Op with the 49th LAA (78 Div) from Apr 1943 to Dec 1944 (North Africa,Sicily,Italy, Egypt).
The Regiment was disbanded in Dec 1944 and I was retrained (in Italy) by the Royal Armoured Corps.
Served as a Loader-Op with the 4th QOH from Mar 1945 to Jan 1946 (Italy, Austria, Germany)
Finished up as Tech Cpl for "A" Sqdrn.

I was "De-mobbed" in Apr 1947
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