French War Memorials, a quick query.

[Owen]

Harry & Dave just to clear up why I was asking is that I was reading about the Syrian Campaign & wondered where the Vichy dead of that campaign were buried & commemorated. (see post #1)
I'm also wondering about those killed in Madagascar & while we're at it, North Africa.

[Rich Payne]

I found something here for you Owen.

Bishop of good hope, The | Spectator, The | Find Articles at BNET

It seems that the Vichy graves on Madagascar never bore names and they are now untended.

Rich

[Owen]

Excellent work, Rich.
Thanks.

Over the broken wall the graveyard was a wilderness grazed by goats. I waded through the dry brown stalks, trying not to think about snakes, past desolate clumps of grey, leggy cabbage. Only the newest graves bore a handpainted sign and a few whitewashed rocks to frame the gap macheted out of scrub. Unmaintained, it all returns to bush.
There are no identities on the rusting crosses in the French military section. The only names are those of the battles of 1942: Nosy-Komba, Hell-Ville, Ambomadiro, Betsiaka, Diego Suarez, Cap Diego, Anjiamena, Joffreville, Sakaramy, Vohema, Andapa.

[Paul Reed]

Fascinating stuff!

[von Poop]

grazed by goats

I wonder... certainly tagged as Madagascar and in the area of Diego Suarez:
visit the deceased on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
gone on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

[Owen]

Reading about Aleppo War Cemetery these two French cemeteries get a mention.

two French cemeteries - Aleppo French Military Cemetery and Deir ez Zor French Military Cemetery.

Anyone know anymore about these two?
Would Vichy servicemen be buried there?
Or are they from 14-18?

EDIT Found this .
Le Cimetière militaire français de Dmeir - Ambassade de France en Syrie
Le Cimetière militaire français de Dmeir in Syria.
Can anyone with a better grasp of French find out if any Vichy casualties are buried there?

It says ..

et les combats de la seconde guerre mondiale.

so that must include them?

[Paul Reed]

Could be, Adam! The graves look standard enough to be military.

[Harry Ree]

Originally Posted by CROONAERT

I must confess to being a little confused here, Harry. I wasn't aware that we were just talking about soldiers who died under the Vichy regime in France. The way I read the question, I thought it was worldwide. (also, where did I mention the defence of Metz 1940 and the Japanese annexation of Indo-China?)

Anyway, the point of my post was to say that I'd expect Vichy casualties (ie. those who died from the metropolitan defence forces ,the Armee d'Afrique, and the armies in the other colonies, etc, post July 1940 and prior to November 27th 1942 whether or not the cause was for German/Italian or French interests) would be listed on local war memorials if the local commune allowed it - no hard and fast rules with these - in some cases. It would probably take a little research to work out who was who from a list of names anyway. They are certainly entitled to French wargrave status.

Dave.

Dave

Apparently the reason why French casualties from the exterior have been interred in France is that the legislation passed on 16 October 1946 allowed French next of kin to repatriate remains back to the French interior, ie French mainland.These repatriations covered remains from:

Indo China. Any conflict with neighbouring countries such as Thai would be included.Presumabily covers your reference to the France -Thai conflict Oct 1940 to May 1941.

Korea.

Madagascar

All in all, 125.000 remains were brought back to France covering both World Wars

I would think that there would not be no reference as regards memorials to those who fell whilst under the Vichy administration and whose remains were repatriated.The cause is deep seated.

Regarding those who fell under the Vichy administration, there is no trace as far as I can see on the official website "Memoire des Hommmes"

It would be very hard for French Departments to impose or otherwise, local memorials to those who served Vichy.They would not sit well against Third Republic casualties,resistants, deportees, STO and civil victims listed on these memorials which adorn most villages in France.

Again I have yet to find any death commemorated on memorials with a reference to Vichy service in my travels throughout France.Vichy service was something that people tended to keep to themselves, postwar, particular involvement in the French interior.Postwar, the French would never have agreed to Vichy dead, paricularly those who served in the quasie militias, to have wargrave status.The postion may have changed now but I have not seen any evidence of it and as I see it the focus is still on those who "Mort Pour La France" and not those who died in the service of Vichy.

Interestingly, Mitterand served within the Vichy administration on his release from being a POW in Germany as an Adminstrator for the welfare of POWs.However it wasn't long before he was whizzed away by the RAF to London to join De Gaulle and the Free French.

An interesting subject.