Obtaining RAF service records - The Rules....

hello Lizrc

quite possibly he has his name on a Memorial away from the area.
Have you tried St James Gerrards Cross

I have checked the local memorials I have Amersham/Beaconsfield/Chalfont/Chalfont St Giles/Chalfont St Peter/Denham/Loudwater just in case he was on.

LEVY, PAUL ALBERT

Rank:
Flying Officer
Trade:
Pilot
Service No:
127244
Date of Death:
28/08/1943
Age:
20
Regiment/Service:
Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve

57 Sqdn.
Grave Reference
11. G. 7.
Cemetery
DURNBACH WAR CEMETERY
Additional Information:
Son of Ralph Paul Levy, M.C., and Olive Louise Levy, of City of London.

link below to apply for his service records
Error pages

regards
Clive

Hello Lizrc, welcome to the forum. I have the following details of the loss although they are very sparse.

27-28 August 1943

57 Squadron
Lancaster III W5008 DX-B
Op. Nuremberg

Took off from Scampton at 2131 hrs. Those who died are buried in Durnbach war Cemetery

Crew.

F/O. P A. Levy +
Sgt. W S. Lynn +
Sgt. W. MacKillop RCAF +
Sgt. R. May pow.
Sgt. W C M. Thomas +
F/S. J C. Perry RAAF +
Sgt. T R. Crowther +

Source - RAF Bomber Command Losses Vol.4 - W R. Chorley.


The Nuremberg raid of 27/28 August 1943

674 aircraft - 349 Lancasters, 221 Halifaxes, 104 Stirlings - to Nuremburg. 33 aircraft - 11 of each type on the raid - lost, 4.9 per cent of the force.
The marking for this raid was based mainly on H2S. 47 of the Pathfinder H2S aircraft were ordered to check their equipment by dropping a 1,000-lb bomb on Heilbronn while flying to Nuremberg. 28 Pathfinder aircraft were able to carry out this order. Nuremberg was found to be free of cloud but it was very dark. The initial Pathfinder markers were accurate but a creepback quickly developed which could not be stopped because so many Pathfinder aircraft had difficulties with their H2S sets. The Master Bomber could do little to persuade the Main Force to move their bombing forward; only a quarter of the crews could hear his broadcasts.



Source - The Bomber Command War Diaries - M. Middlebrook / C. Everitt

 

Clive,
Thanks ever so much for your quick response. I'm a little overwhelmed and very moved at all the information you supplied and am very grateful for your help.
Regards,
Liz

 

Mr. Clare,
Thanks so much for your help and all the information you posted regarding aircraft loss. I am most appreciative.
Regards,
Liz

 

Hello Liz

There is a War Memorial in Gerrards Cross
I will check it out for you next week

regards
Clive

 

As there was an Aussie on board there is a synopsis of the crash available from the research of a bloke called Alan Storr from Canberra - both Spidge & I have the info on our computers, but he has a better program to format the info.

I will drop him a PM to see if he has spotted this thread....



PERRY, John Charles - (Flight Sergeant) 410721 RAAF

Lancaster W5008

Zeckern, Germany

28-Aug-43

57 Squadron

 

I am at work until 1900 so will post later this evening.

Cheers

Geoff

 

I applied for my father's RAF service record last year and was very pleased with the service from Cranwell. I could not supply his service number and only gave them his name, date of birth and RAF trade. I had read that, at the time, the wait was 6/8 weeks and was presently surprised when a package arrived in 3 weeks. I received a copy of form 543 and noted there was a TNT sticker on it, I did wonder if this was just to with the post or whether TNT are involved with the archiving.
I am doing a history of his life, much of which was unknown prior to 1945, and this form did provide some very useful "titbits" of information like his occupation and place of work prior to joining up in 1939, pre and post war addresses etc.
Unfortunately, and not Cranwell's fault, his record is a blank between October 1942 when arriving in India/Burma and March 1945 when arriving back in the UK, this is the bit I was most interested in as his time in Burma had a big influence on the rest of his life (and indirectly mine).
By luck, shortly afterwards I was able to trace children of his uncle (who he thought was his brother, but that is another story). His uncle was in Army intelligence all over North Africa, Greece and Italy and it seems they had corresponded on a weekly basis. Although my father's letters are long lost his uncle's letters to his wife survive and often refer to my father so via these I have been able to gain an insight to what happened to him in Burma, albeit they have raised more questions than they have answered. Given uncle moved around a lot and my father,going by the squadron history, moved very frequently from one airstrip to another, I have been truly amazed at the efficiency of getting post to our troops.
A few abbreviations and notes on his record remain a mystery despite help from this forum and other sources. David

 

As there was an Aussie on board there is a synopsis of the crash available from the research of a bloke called Alan Storr from Canberra - both Spidge & I have the info on our computers, but he has a better program to format the info.

I will drop him a PM to see if he has spotted this thread....



28th August 1943 - 57sqn - Durnbach War Cemetery, Germany.


On this day there were 224 Commonwealth Air Force Deaths.

ATA

RAF Iraq Levies

RAF 169

RAAF 20

RCAF 29

RIAF 2

RNZAF 4

SAAF

Rhodesia Air Askari Corps

WAAF

WAAAF

WAAF (SAAF)

WAAC

RAAF FATALITIES IN SECOND WORLD WAR AMONG
RAAF PERSONNEL SERVING ON ATTACHMENT
IN ROYAL AIR FORCE SQUADRONS AND SUPPORT UNITS

410721 Flight Sergeant PERRY, John Charles

Source:

AWM 237 (65) NAA : A705, 166/32/1176 Commonwealth War Graves records
W R Chorley : RAF Bomber Command Losses of the Second World War, Page 289,
Volume 1943
Aircraft Type: Lancaster
Serial number: W 5008
Radio call sign: DX – B
Unit: ATTD 57 SQN RAF

Summary:

Lancaster W5008 took off from RAF East Kirkby at 2131hours on the night of 27/28th
August 1943, detailed to bomb Nuremburg, Germany. Nothing was heard from the
aircraft after take off and it failed to return to base.

Crew:

RAF FO Levy, P A Captain (Pilot) †
RAF Sgt W S Lynn, (Flight Engieer) †
RCAF Sgt W MacKillop, (Navigator) †
RAF Sgt R May, (Air Bomber) (POW)
RAF Sgt W C Thomas, (Wireless Air Gunner) †
RAAF 410721 Flt Sgt J C Perry, (Mid Upper Gunner) †
RAF Sgt T R Crowther, (Rear Gunner) †

The aircraft crashed near the village of Zeckern presumably as a result of enemy action.
Zeckern is 18 miles north west of Nuremburg.

Six of the crew were killed and Sgt May was a POW.

Those killed are buried in the Durnbach War Cemetery, Locality Bad Tolz, Bayern, Germany.

Durnbach is a village 16kms east of Bad Tolz, a town 48kms south of Munich.

120 Commonwealth Airmen were buried in Durnbach cemetery this day.





In Memory of
Flying Officer Pilot
Paul Albert Levy
127244, 57 Sqdn., Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
who died on 28 August 1943 Age 20
Son of Ralph Paul Levy, M.C., and Olive Louise Levy, of City of London.
Remembered with Honour
Durnbach War Cemetery

In Memory of
Sergeant Flt. Engr.
Walter Stanley Lynn
1615745, 57 Sqdn., Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
who died on 28 August 1943 Age 20
Son of Katherine Emma Lynn, of Deeping Gate, Northamptonshire.
Remembered with Honour
Durnbach War Cemetery

In Memory of
Flight Sergeant Nav.
William MacKillop
R/124707, 57 (R.A.F.) Sqdn., Royal Canadian Air Force
who died on 28 August 1943 Age 28
Son of James and Mary Bell MacKillop, of Glace Bay, Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, Canada.
Remembered with Honour
Durnbach War Cemetery

In Memory of
Sergeant W.Op./Air Gnr.
William Charles Marcus Thomas
1203830, 57 Sqdn., Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
who died on 28 August 1943
Son of Charles and Jane Thomas; husband of Lilian Marjorie Thomas, of Holborn London.
Remembered with Honour
Durnbach War Cemetery

In Memory of
Flight Sergeant
John Charles Perry
410721, Royal Australian Air Force
who died on 28 August 1943 Age 24
Son of Rupert John and Ruby Amelia Perry, of Carnegie, Victoria, Australia.
Remembered with Honour
Durnbach War Cemetery

In Memory of
Sergeant Air Gnr.
Thomas Raymond Crowther
1414489, 57 Sqdn., Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
who died on 28 August 1943 Age 20
Son of Francis Edwin and Florence Eliza Crowther, of Cross Hands, Carmarthenshire.
Remembered with Honour
Durnbach War Cemetery

 

I have just joined this site and am wondering how to start research on a family friend who was in the RAFVR. He was from Gerrards Cross, Buckinghamshire and died in WW2. How can I find out more about him, where he served, where he died, and if there is a war memorial with his name on it. I searched the Buckinghamshire War Memorials list for Gerrards Cross but didn't see his name on any of them. His name is Paul Albert Levy.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

Hello Liz

I have photographed and checked the Gerrards Cross Memorial and he is not on there.

regards
Clive

 

What do you typically receive for your money?
Is it a one page document, joining date, name, DOB, etc....or is it a detailed history of all missions and postings?

 

My father trained allied pilots to fly B-17's in Alabama in 1943. We're trying to find an RAF pilot named ANGUS WATSON who became a family friend while he was in training there. Over the years we've lost track of him and would like to know more about him and where he was from. I was a young lad at the time and over the years we lost track of him. I'm sure he's deceased by now but would like to find out more.

I don't remember the name of the unit in Alabama and am researching that separately. Perhaps someone could help by telling me how to access RAF records to find those pilots who trained here in the U.S.

Thanks,

Fred
Hi Fred,

The name 'Angus Watson' rings a bell with me.

 

He was my father.

Angus Watson

 

He was my father.

Angus Watson

He would have been my Father-in-law!

JJ

 

Hi
Looking for some advice please? I am looking into a missing headstone for my dads cousin, Sgt John Kerry RAFVR KIA 27/01/44. I have found the grave site in a civvy cemetery but no stone. I have reported in to the CWGC but as my dad has passed away and Sgt Kerry has no known next of kin i am starting for scratch as far as what Sqn etc he was with.
Anyone suggest any website etc

It is sad as both Sgt Kerrys brothers, Sgt Richard Kerry RAFVR was KIA in a on raid on Bremen & Gunner Joe Kerry KIA in Italy. This ended that line of Kerrys & i have only just found this out a couple of weeks ago.

Any help/advice would be most welcome.

martin kerry

 

Hi Martin

I'd recommend you apply for his service records as detailed in this thread.

Otherwise, you should also start your own thread in the Research & Genealogy section of this Forum. That way it will attract those who have books on RAF losses who may be able to track down what unit he may have served in. It might get missed in this thread, as that query is not to do with applying for service records.

In regard to the missing headstone, you have done the right thing in telling the CWGC. Just make sure you get a reply indicating what they intend to do.

Cheers - Rob

 

Hello Martin, welcome to the forum. The following re the loss of Sgt. John Kerry is taken from RAF Bomber Command Losses Vol.8 - W R. Chorley.

Its possible that the reason there is no CWGC headstone is that members of the crew were buried by their family's thus the CWGC would not have been involved.



26-27 January 1944

1660 HCU
Stirling III EH933
Op. Training.

Took off from Swinderby for a night cross-country, with two flight engineers including the crew of eight. While flying at high altitude, just inland from the south coast of Devon, a sudden and terrible disasters overtook the crew and their aircraft dropped from the sky, breaking apart as it fell. Thus at 0004 hrs the fuselage and most of the mainplane crashed into a hillside at Coppleham Cross, north of Exton and a mere six miles south south east from the city of Exeter. Eventually debris was recovered from along a path stretching three and a half miles eastwards from the main impact point. Air Investigation Branch specialists later determined that the rear fuselage had detached at around 14,000 feet, following at circa 10,000 - 11,000 feet by the elevators and rear turret.

Following identification, the eight airmen were buried under private arrangements by their next of kin.

Crew.

Sgt. R A. Partridge +
Sgt. A. Thursby +
Sgt. H. Hewitt +
Sgt. C V. Tomkinson +
Sgt. T H. Jones +
Sgt. B. Ackroyd +
Sgt. J. Kerry +
Sgt. R. Street +

 

How can you find out someone service number.
we have full name, date of birth and we know which squadron he served with for at least part of his service, but we have no service number. Any help would be much appreciated.

 

Can you give us the details and we can show you how. As long their not John Smith or a name like that.

There is a database if sorts called AIR78 in the UK national archives, I assume your taking about a member of the RAF and not Canadian or Australian etc?

Give us tge name and we can help

 

And the squadron/unit you know he was with.

 

As far as I know there were seven British Flying Training Schools they were as follows:

•  1 BFTS, Terrell, Texas
  
  
•  2 BFTS, Lancaster, California
  
  
•  3 BFTS, Miami, Oklahoma
  
  
•  4 BFTS, Mesa, Arizona
  
  
•  5 BFTS, Clewiston, Florida
  
  
•  6 BFTS, Ponca City, Oklahoma
  
  
•  7 BFTS, Sweetwater, Texas (May 42)

I don't know of a BFTS in Alabama perhaps it was introduced after 1942. My second cousin trained as an RAFVR bomber pilot on the no 2 course from 6 Dec 1941 at No 1 BFTS Terrell Texas. If you get his record it may show No. ? BFTS USA and the date. However it may not be a BFTS Angus Watson was at , it may have been an US airforce training base not a British one. Maxwell Field Alabama trained US Army Airforce B17 pilots, so may have trained Angus Watson as well.

Angus Watson was an ex Essex Police Officer who became a Pilot Officer in the RAF and trained Craig Field Alabama