Family Soldiers: 1/4th Essex (WW2) & 25 Field Regiment R.A.(Post-War)

Discussion in 'Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy' started by Charley Fortnum, Mar 21, 2015.

  1. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    A few excellent photographs extracted from the 1/4th Essex's 1944 War Diaries (*Tip of the hat to Andy*):

    Battalion Officers - Sept '44

    P6220745-2.JPG

    P6220746.JPG

    Battalion Boxing team - Aug '44
    P6220747.JPG

    P6220748.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
    CL1 and Drew5233 like this.
  2. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Found a bargain for a few quid on ebay - here's a preview - Sidney Kirkman leads proceedings and there's an awful lot of detail on logistics and some excellent maps - which may have the contemporary grid references! (also features articles on Ypres and Meiktila):

    20160623_142553_1.JPG 20160623_142613_1.JPG 20160623_142630_1.JPG 20160623_142702.JPG

    As ever, if anybody wants me to search for information or upload images, I'm happy to do so.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
    CL1 and stolpi like this.
  3. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    An unpromising lead here, but I thought that I'd try my luck. Along with my grandfather's pictures of his comrades in 1/4th Essex, there is one photo of a relative in uniform and we cannot identify him -- or even when the image could have been taken. The inscription to the rear appears to be "M Meen" - which was his mother's maiden name, so it is quite conceivable that he could be a cousin. Is there any evidence whatsoever (uniform style?, hat?) to suggest who this man could be? If there is, I'm missing it. It is c. WW2 - right?

    IMG_20160403_0026.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
    stolpi likes this.
  4. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    ??

    England & Wales, Birth Index, 1916-2005
    Name: Maurice B Meen
    Mother's Maiden Surname: Lilley
    Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1922
    Registration district: Orsett
    Inferred County: Essex, Suffolk
    Volume Number: 4a
    Page Number: 1150

    England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2007

    Name: Maurice Bertram Meen
    Birth Date: 25 Jun 1922
    Date of Registration: Sep 1999
    Age at Death: 77
    Registration district: Brentwood
    Inferred County: Essex
    Register Number: A51B
    District and Subdistrict: 4661A
    Entry Number: 243

    Guesswork
    TD

    edited to add:

    Maurice Bertram Meen

    Birth: 25 Jun 1922 - Essex, England
    Death: 6 Sep 1999 - Basildon, Essex, England
    Marriage: 17 Jan 1946 - Essex, England
    F: Percy James Meen
    M: Florence Emily Lilley
     
    CL1 and Charley Fortnum like this.
  5. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Brilliant.

    Am emailing detail to my father to check whether this is likely to be a relative. Is there any mention of military service at that source?
    He may well have been another Essex Regiment man.

    Edit: By another stroke of luck, I may have identified him as a member of S-Coy 1/4th Essex in 1943.

    When they say that this generation didn't talk about what had done in the war, it isn't an exaggeration is it? How have neither I nor my father heard that his cousin was most likely in the same battalion as he was?

    I now need to contact older aunts and uncles, but thank you very much, Tricky Dicky - this has opened up another path for me to wander down.
     
  6. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Back to battalion business, I found a gem in the 1/4th Essex Diary for Aug '41:

    No volunteers for that one, I suspect!
     
    sam everett likes this.
  7. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Charley

    "Is there any mention of military service at that source?" was your question to which I do not have an answer, I assume he survived the war intact, and therefore does not appear on databases for POW's or those that died, luckily for him.


    The info however, if he is the right man provide info to obtain his service record

    TD
     
  8. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Consensus this end seems to be that he is the right man and that although we aren't in touch with that branch of the family it may be possible to contact them. He may have been mayor of Thurrock at some point in his later life.

    You're quite right, of course, about applying for records.

    Many thanks,
     
  9. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Charley

    The edited to add: bit on my post 64 above is from 1 of 5 (I think) family trees on Ancestry that include his details in their trees - so perhaps to reconnect to that branch of the family .................................................

    TD
     
  10. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    TD, will get in touch by PM.

    I was reading through the War Diary for 1940 and by pure luck the one page of the appendices had been typed on reused paper. The rear - as you can see - is scored out, but it's actually very interesting. No other 'Daily Orders' are to be found in the 39-45 Diaries (I don't have '46, but it isn't likely), and I'd really like to get hold of them. I'm about to fire of an email to the regimental museum but wondered if anybody could suggest another location that copies might reside? Edit: it looks as if this is the only surviving page :(

    P6290618.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
  11. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
    Mark Surridge likes this.
  12. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

     
  13. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    CL1 likes this.
  14. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Fabulous mascot from Sierra Leone:

    4066005239.JPG

    The Leopard mascot of A Company, 1st/4th Battalion, in Sierra Leona in 1941 pictured with Company Sergeant Major Carty. The big cat was called “Dagga” because A company were from Dagenham.

    Post Memories: Royal Anglian regiment’s long-standing connection with Barking and Dagenham

    S-Coy also had a dog named 'Sousse' by late '43 - presumably acquired in Tunisia - although it's unclear whether it was a personal pet or a company mascot.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
  15. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    If, like me, you plan to plot movements around the Mediterranean, this outline map could prove a helpful basis:

    GSGS_MEDITERRANEAN_SEA_MAY_1943.jpg

    It marks only major sites (still a good number) and omits all but the essentials, leaving plenty of space for your own annotations - it's also vast (message me for a full-size version of either).

    And for Italy:

    2000px-Italy_topographic_map-blank.svg.png

    P.M. me for huge-size copies of these.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2018
  16. Stuart Avery

    Stuart Avery In my wagon & not a muleteer.

    Charley, by now you may have obtained a copy of the above book. If not, then Pm me. Also, there is another book that may be of interest to yourself.
    THE FANTASTIC FIFTH A HISTORY OF THE OLDEST INDIAN INFANTRY BRIGADE By Col. Anil Shorey.
    Didn't even now both of these books where in exsistence untill this morning. They'll be winging there way to my letter box, later on this week.
    Regards
    Stu.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2016
    Charley Fortnum likes this.
  17. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Stu, I haven't.

    Most kind - will get in touch.

    By chance, I too have recently learnt of the existence of the Shorey book - I'm off to see whether you've bought the copy that has been sitting in my virtual shopping basket over the weekend!

    I know that both books contain post-war material (in the former I believe it predominates), but I want to know of anything of note not mentioned in the (superb) divisional history by Lieut-Colonel GR Stevens.

    Edit: You have!
     
  18. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I realise that it's likely to be somewhat dry, but could anybody give me a broad idea of the likely contents of this:

    489592884.jpg

    (wags need not point out that it's likely to contain the battalion's standing orders...)
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
  19. Stuart Avery

    Stuart Avery In my wagon & not a muleteer.

    Just for the record, i purchased the books before I'd come across this thread. Some people may think other wise.
    Charley, I've received your Pm. Will be in touch. Sorry that i beat you to it, that was not my intention. Rest assured.
    Stu.
     
  20. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    God, no - didn't mean to imply anything of the sort, Stu. Absolutely no implication of wrongdoing on your behalf. On the contrary, I'm grateful for your getting in touch. Perhaps I expressed myself poorly.
     

Share This Page