24th Lancers - Roll of Honour

Discussion in 'RAC & RTR' started by Ramiles, Jan 10, 2016.

  1. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    Steve, Were there any 24th lancers who were wounded in Normandy but returned to England and who sadly died of there injuries? I was asked by the guy who runs the fallenheroesofnormandy he asked so he could add them to his memorial site?

    Regards
    Shaun
    Just thought I could check in NHL they maybe in the roll of honour but not on his site
     
  2. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Shaun

    Only Tpr Arthur Constable falls into that category. He is buried in Bridlington and is commemorated on the Bridlington War Memorial.

    There are other 24L buried in the UK but they were casualties during training etc prior to Normandy.

    A total, I think of four. I've visited their graves over the years and taken photos.

    Steve
     
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  3. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Lieutenant Evan Roland (Tommy) Thomas (Ex 24th Lancer - A squadron)

    KIA 20/11/1944 - whilst serving with the 4th/7th Royal Dragoon Guards: Casualty Details

    See also: 24th Lancers Regimental Nominal Roll and Postings August 1944

    He is also mentioned on p159 of NHL assisting, on 26/6/1944 a wounded friend (24th Lancer Lieutenant John Money) to a field hospital.

    The 24th L Wardiary has:

    7/3/44 - 2/Lts J.I.Money and E.R.Thomas joined the Regiment from RAC, OCTU.
     
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  4. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    OK thanks Steve I shall pass on his details
     
  5. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Nb...
    Karl has recently posted (19th November 2016) some pictures of graves / memorials including of these ex24th Lancers (i.e. those quoted above that subsequently joined the SRY) here: The Sherwood Rangers in NW Europe 1944/45 | Facebook
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2016
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  6. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Another picture of an ex-24th Lancer... (in case people recognise the face in their own or others pics :))

    John Cropper (on the cover of the book "Dad's War" by John and Andy Cropper).

    [​IMG]

    Albeit John Cropper was a late joiner to the 24th L - an early reinforcement, I think in the Normandy campaign.

    I occasionally see copies of this book up for sale - at varying prices - I bought mine (not for sale - a good copy - but now quite well read :D) about a year ago though for £19.95.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dads-War-Andy-Cropper/dp/0952422204

    Dad's War by Cropper, Andy and John Cropper: Anmas Publications, Thurlstone, Devon 9780952422204 Card Covers, Limited Edition. - C P Books Limited

    The IWM apparently has a copy that perhaps might be browsed/read on request? Not sure what they "allow": albeit with a slight typo there :blush: on the listing - so hopefully it's not stored in the midst of their Victoriana.;)

    Dad's war [a tank commander in Europe, 1844-45 with the XXIV Lancers and Sherwood Rangers Yeomanry]

    Dad's war [a tank commander in Europe, 1844-45 with the XXIV Lancers and Sherwood Rangers Yeomanry] (LBY 01 / 1442)
     
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  7. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Another image of an ex-24th Lancer I found through "google trawling" here: BBC - WW2 People's War - Steve Whitbread - Home Guard to Tankman 1940 - 1946

    Steve Whitbread

    [​IMG]

    Along with quite a bit of bio on the old BBC people's war site. Including some refs. to the Normandy landing and i.e. this bit "took a trip to Normandy and together we visited Gold Beach, Bayeux and Villers Bocage where Dad had encounterd fierce fighting in 1944 and had skirmishes with the dreaded German Tiger Tank."

    I had a look at the regimental nominal roll: 24th Lancers Regimental Nominal Roll and Postings August 1944

    And there is an A/Sgt Whitbread VS. : (Xiv) att 270 FDS

    Which seems to fit with the bio at the BBC site, and his comment "and after a short stay with a holding unit I joined the 2nd Fife & Forfar Yeomanry." albeit the initial "V" in the type on the Roll seems to suggest he went perhaps by his second name "S" for "Steve" presumably, in preference to the initial "V" there.

    Doesn't have a mention in NHL. Which often mentions which squadron people were in.

    (I don't know if he is in any of your lists SDP?)

    Rm.
     
  8. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Rob

    Army number: 14231113
    L/Cpl V S Whitbread
    Trade: Driver/Operator in HQ Squadron

    As you have him as a A/Sgt, he must have been promoted in Normandy.
     
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  9. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Thanks SDP,

    The BBC site: BBC - WW2 People's War - Steve Whitbread - Home Guard to Tankman 1940 - 1946

    ...has: "During the period of training for the D-Day landings, I was promoted from L/Cpl to Cpl and whilst at Milford-on-Sea to L/Sgt. I was promoted to Troop Sergeant in Normandy on 21st June 1944 and granted War Substantive Rank of Sergeant on 18th December 1944."

    The War Diary for the 24th L has:

    18/6/44 The Regiment remained at Hervieu throughout the day resting and maintaining the vehicles. The day was uneventful. ‘C’ Sqns defensive position at Parc de Bois Londe, was relieved by a Sqn of the SRY in the early morning.

    Hervieu

    18-24/6/44 These days were spent by the Regiment in preparing for a set piece attack on the Tessel Wood feature in support of 146 Inf. Bde. The attack had been planned to go in on 19th June, but was postponed daily until it was finally put in. The Regiment took the opportunity during this necessarily uneasy period to rest the men and maintain the tanks as much as possible. In the meantime, Officers devoted continual study to air photographs and defensive overlays applicable to the attack.

    So it looks like he was promoted to Troop Sergeant during the "uneasy period" of rest, i.e. during preparation for Tessel Wood / Rauray etc.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2016
  10. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Re. Captain Jack Saggers and Cpl Jack Worsfold who parachuted into Yugoslavia and perhaps? Trp Donald Barrett who was killed in action in Greece while working with the partisans (p195 of NHL) Casualty Details KIA 10/09/1944 - 24th Lancers attd. Raiding Support Regiment.

    I'm never quite sure why some days "google" out performs... and delivers up all kinds of unexpected goodies - must be proximity to Xmas or some such :unsure: ;) however I recently stumbled across this:

    BBC - WW2 People's War - Mission to Jugoslavia

    "Contributed by ddnormandy
    People in story: Leonard Bolden
    Location of story: Bridlington
    Background to story: Army
    Article ID: A4027231
    Contributed on: 08 May 2005
    BRIDLINGTON 1943 - Special mission to Yugoslavia

    Radio operators and officers, from both 23rd Hussars and 24th Lancers, were asked to volunteer for a special duty. I was among the four radio operators who volunteered from the Lancers.

    Together with others from the Hussars we were taken to a parachute battalion barracks in Oxford. Here we were given full details of the operation to parachute into Yugoslavia to assist the resistance partisans - but then they realised they had forgotten to test us radio operators for our proficiency in morse!.

    We were taken to a tent and seated at a long table with morse keys in front of each person. A sergeant then told us he would give us a ‘warm up’ and sent a message at a reasonable speed which we all managed to get.

    Then an officer came in and the sergeant saluted and said “I’ve given them a warm-up and they were all OK”.

    The officer took his place at the morse key and sent a message at such a speed that I, for one, couldn't even get the first few letters, let alone any of the words. However, two of our Lancer friends did take the message perfectly correctly and one of them was such a 'natural' that he didn’t write each word as it came but waited and wrote a sentence at a time!.
    Therefore out of our group of half a dozen or so there were only two who were capable of doing the job!. After saying our goodbyes and good luck to them they went off to join other men who had been accepted from other regiments.

    It now dawned on the officers of the unit that here was a group of men who had all been completely briefed on the complete operation but were not now taking part. There was only one solution we would all have to sign the official secrets act and then be confined to the camp until the operation had been mounted. For some seven or eight days we hung around the camp enjoying the excellent food and reveling in the comfort of having bed sheets at night. During that time we heard that one of our friends had been killed doing a practice jump and an officer from the 23rd hussars (Captain Stephenson) was killed on the flight over. Then we were given a forty-eight hour leave pass, and travel warrants to re-join our units in Bridlington.

    When we arrived back at our unit we rejoined our squadrons and settled down to normal work.
    Then, some three weeks later at breakfast our intelligence officer came over to my table and, after getting the friends I was sitting with to move to another table, he said "I've got some news for you about the Lancers who were accepted for that special job you went for in Oxford. A report has come through from a liason officer with the Yugoslav partisans that, as they landed, our men were shot by communist resistance fighters to get their equipment".

    Standing up to go he added “Don't forget, there are still some of our people out there so don't let on what we've been talking about will you?".

    Len Bolden
    "
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2016
  11. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Re. (J=John) Bruce Millar (ex-24th Lancer)

    Casualty Details

    I recently (only just) noticed the black and white picture here...

    [​IMG]

    Book by Dutch author remembers heroism of Dereham soldier during the second world war

    Which I guess, perhaps, potentially, was him?

    And associated thread: http://ww2talk.com/index.php?threads/dutch-author-remembers-dereham-soldier.36510/#post-444400

    With...

    Also on the postings here (with first name beginning with J (John) ):

    24th Lancers Regimental Nominal Roll and Postings August 1944
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2016
  12. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Re. Lieut A.C.Hawkins (nicknamed "Jack")


    There are one or two mentions of "Jack" Hawkins in None Had Lances (The Story of the 24th Lancers) albeit not much, it does however say that A.C.Hawkins chaired the 24th L reunions after the death of Brigadier Anderson, from 1973.

    Lieut A.C.Hawkins was my grandfather's troop leader (i.e. he "Jack" was the tank commander of the 1st troop of "C" squadron, whilst my grandfather was the tank commander of the 2nd tank of the 1st troop of "C" squadron). Gd. "nicknamed" him though as "the Hawk" :blush:

    Gd. mentions that Lieut A.C.Hawkins was wounded in the arm, fairly early in the Normandy campaign I think and...

    24th Lancers Regimental Nominal Roll and Postings August 1944

    Has him then being transferred, when the 24th L were disbanded at the start of August 1944, into the 4/7 D.G.

    Where he became the Second-in-command of their "A" Squadron....

    Hawkins.jpg

    Ref: p188 https://www.amazon.com/First-Last-Regimental-Narratives-Unofficial/dp/B000P1MYEE

    "The first and the last : the story of the 4th/7th Royal Dragoon Guards, 1939-1945 Further information compiled from the regimental war diary, squadron diaries, personal narratives, and the unofficial "Actions of the 4th/7th Royal Dragoon Guards in France" by Major J.D.P. Stirling, illustrated with maps drawn by Trooper S. Oxley."
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2020
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  13. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Re. Trooper Len Eades - There's quite a bit (of varied info.) about his time with the 24th Lancers at: BBC - WW2 People's War - How I learnt to drive - anything

    His wounding in Normandy though:

    "Five days after the landing, I remember lying in small hole which I had dug to shelter in when I was hit in the foot with shrapnel. Although I was not seriously wounded, I was sent back to England."

    I think means he was not on the nominal roll at:
    24th Lancers Regimental Nominal Roll and Postings August 1944
     
  14. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    Cpt I Kerr 26/6/44 aged 26
    Tpr R Quinn 17/6/44 aged 23
    Tpr J W Brown 12/6/44 aged 21
    Tpr J Simpson 8/6/44 aged 29
    LCpl T W Mintoft 12/6/44 aged 36
    Tpr G C Dean 26/6/44 aged 19
    Cpl W C Armstrong 13/7/44 aged 35
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
  15. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    Tpr T H Rowland 25/6/44 aged 20
    Tpr J F Stevenson 25/6/44 aged 25
    Cpl H J Turvey 26/6/44 aged 24
    Tpr F G Wagstaff 8/6/44 aged 30
    L/Sjt G A Taylor 8/6/44 aged 24
    Cpl A P Packman 9/8/44. Aged 30
    Cpt A H Poole 7/6/44 aged 34
     

    Attached Files:

  16. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    Tpr E R Newnham 10/6/44 aged 22
    Tpr H P Compton 10/6/44 aged 20
    Tpr G A Giles 12/6/44 aged 20
    Cpl F J E Kirby 12/6/44 aged 36
    Tpr P Lee 12/6/44 aged 28
    Tpr C A Brindley 9-10/6/44 aged 32
    Sjt F J W Fielder 11/6/44 aged 37
     

    Attached Files:

  17. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    Cpl W J Gillman 1944
    Tpr L G Attwood 1944
    Tpr L G Derbyshire 1944
    Tpr S P Hearnh 1944
    Tpr W Heath 1944
    Tpr W C H Mant 1944
    Tpr T S Turner 1944
    Tpr N Vetter 1944
    Tpr R F West 1944
    Tpr A C M Wager 1944
     

    Attached Files:

  18. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    Tpr J W Brown 12/6/44 aged 21
    Tpr N Robinson 12/6/44 aged 27
    Tpr R J Stephens 12/6/44 aged 34
    Sjt S Norton 17/6/44 aged 32
    Tpr C W Bullock 11/9/44 aged 35
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 15, 2018
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  19. norton 407545

    norton 407545 Well-Known Member

    all the above photographs of the 24th lancers headstones were taken by me during a visit in June 2015 and June 2017 the resolution have been reduced so I could post it to the forum. If anyone ever wants a higher resolution copy please feel free to contact me via this forum and I will email the original to you.
     
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  20. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Shaun

    Thank you most sincerely for posting the images of the headstones. A very fitting tribute to those brave men who gave their tomorrows for our todays. We will remember them.
     

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