24th Lancers

Discussion in 'RAC & RTR' started by SDP, Feb 17, 2012.

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  1. Parabat1946

    Parabat1946 Member

    Hi,
    My Father was in the 24L from 15/1 1943 after 6 months at 55th Trg Regt until 9/6/44 when he was wounded. I have read a lot of accounts
    but cant seem to find 24L on 9/6.
    Dad was Tpr James Dixon Adamson No 7960745 and when I was small I played with a wooden model of a Sherman which I think he made in hospital.
    He was posted to the 13/18 Hussars 28/1/45 and was wounded again on 12/3/45(possibly in GOCH, either by bombs or shellfire).
    If anyone has any info as to which Sqn/troop he was in I would be very grateful.

    Regds
    Barry
     
  2. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Barry

    According to the Nominal Roll he was a Gunner/Mechanic in 'C' Squadron. Not sure of the Troop or tank.

    They were at Point 103 at that time and in the evening of the 9th 'C' Squadron attacked St Pierre and stayed there overnight.

    He is not mentioned by name in 'None Had Lances' but, because of other information to hand, albeit circumstantial, it is possible that he was in Lt Bertram Garai's tank which was a Sherman Firefly (5th Troop, tank 1). Alternatively he could have been in Lt Gray's Sherman 75mm tank (4th Troop tank 1). That Sherman tank model you had: long barrel or short barrel......could be a very important clue. Pity your post didn't happen a few months ago before Bertram died!
     
  3. Parabat1946

    Parabat1946 Member

    SDP
    Many thanks for your info, it helps me place his whereabouts on that day.
    According to his mil records, he was attested 2/7/1942, granted W.T.T.P. 2/1/43 (I dont recognise the initials)
    Posted 24Lancers 15/1/43, passed TT Driver/mechanic Group D, class ii, Chippenham,15/1/43.
    Passed TT Gunner/mechanic Group C class iii, Chippenham, 2/2/43, then there is a big gap until 1/7/43 when he
    is AWOL 7 Hrs 16mins which was later ammended as he had phoned in sick whilst on leave.
    The next entry is for embarkation/disembarkation UK/N.W.E.and then another N.W.E/ UK (wounded)dated 9/6/44)
    With regards to the model, I remember it as being very light (probably Balsa), having no tracks or bogies and a turret
    that came off if you faced it to the rear. I was about 8 at the time so I cant remember the gun.
    Is there any info on exercises or schemes that my Dad may have been on as I seem to remember Lulworth coming up.
    Anyway, many thanks for the info.

    Regds
    Barry
     
  4. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Barry

    Lots of those details are familiar. For example many men were drafted into 24L in early 1943. Chippenham is actually Chippenham Park near Newmarket. The rest, as they say, is history. You need to get yourself a copy of None Had Lances, a copy of the War Diary and keep hunting for information. I'll also do my best to help.

    The Lulworth bit is interesting. Used for gunnery training and by 52nd Training Regiment. I believe that may also further imply that he was in Bertram Garai's tank because 24th Lancers were also the first Regiment to try the Firefly Sherman....and I believe that may well have been at Lulworth. Speculative at this stage but might be worth testing the theory via research.
     
  5. Parabat1946

    Parabat1946 Member

    SDP
    I have found a reference to astory of Lt Garai's war at the Imp War Museums' web site. The site is not very user friendly! Do you have any Idea how I can obtain a copy/transcript?
    Sorry I took so long to get back to you , but work and a trip to Arnhem got in the way.

    Regds
    Barry
     
  6. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Barry

    No problem.

    I'm aware of Bertram's interview recording at the IWM. All I can suggest is that you contact them directly for details. I've visited their library in the past and they are very helpful with photocopies etc of photographs and prints but I'm not sure of their approach with tape recordings.

    Best regards
    Steve
     
  7. Parabat1946

    Parabat1946 Member

    Steve

    Thanks for the advice, will contact them ASAP

    Regds

    Barry
     
  8. LittlFletch

    LittlFletch Member

    Hi there Chaps,
    Im doing some reseach regarding shoulder patches and Im just wondering what was the patch worn by the 24th Lancers on D-Day? This may not have been the case for every hostile-only Cavalry regiment but going by the 22nd Dragoons (formed by 2 cadres from the 4th/7th Royal Dragoon Guards and the 5th Royal Inniskilling Dragoon Guards) they unofficially made their own colours/standard guideon. I wonder if the 24th Lancers did the same using elements from the 9th Queen's Royal Lancers and the 17th/21st Lancers. Or did they just wear the brigade patch, the Red Fox?

    Cheers

    Fletch
     
  9. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    They wore the brigade shoulder patch Red Fox on D Day. Have photo to validate this.
     
  10. LittlFletch

    LittlFletch Member

    Cheers SDP,
    Ive trawled the interwebs for 24th Lancers wearing the patch just none exitant, at least on the internet anyway. Even IWM doesn't ave any photos of them wearing the red fox.

    thanks again
     
  11. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    IWM have a photo of an O Group meeting near Rauray on 29th June 1944. Major Luddington of 24L can be seen wearing a Red Fox shoulder patch. I don't know the IWM reference number. The photo was published in the 24L history 'None Had Lances' which is my source of information.
     
  12. LittlFletch

    LittlFletch Member

    Ahhh I must of glossed over it, I just typed in 24th Lancers Patch in the search bar, no wonder I got nothing back really lol. Thanks again.
     
  13. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Ahhh I must of glossed over it, I just typed in 24th Lancers Patch in the search bar, no wonder I got nothing back really lol. Thanks again.

    Remember that only a small proportion of the IWM photographs collection are available to view on their web site. I think this is one of those that can't be viewed.....or it might not be searchable via the term "24th Lancers".
     
    LittlFletch likes this.
  14. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Hello Drew5233,

    I'm chasing up leads on my granddad Benjamin William Albert Symes and would be interested in the above also.

    My family has some bits and bobs on the 24th which I'll try to post on here as and when possible,

    Best regards,

    Rob Miles.
     
  15. Annabolic

    Annabolic New Member

    Hello all,

    I am writing to find some information on Eric Edward Clayton. He is my Father-in-law and was a 24th Lancer. He is still alive and he was talking about the operation.
    He told us that they were not told where they were going. he remembers the day the Germans killed a lot of his fellow servicemen.
    He remembers walking for miles and coming across a young female named Madeline Gulliard ( not sure of the spelling).
    He is trying to find out where he may have been so he can trace where this young lass was. She helped him in his time of need. I believe that he was carrying his best mate(but unfortunately he had died). I know he eventually rejoined with another group and ended up in Antorp.

    I have sent him an email to try and find out is service number and metals. It would be great if someone can shed some light on where this may have happened. Bless him - he is turning 90 this week, and I would love to help him.

    Thank you all :)
     
  16. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Hi Anna ( I guess that's correct?)

    Please give Eric my best wishes.

    That incident could cover a number of occasions. If it was with 24th Lancers then it would have been in the Fontenay Le Pesnel / Tessel Wood / Tilly sur Seulles / Rauray area in Normandy. Eric did mention to me some years ago that he had 'wandered around only to find the Regiment had been split up' aka Disbanded. If that fits his recollections, then the emphasis would be on the Rauray area. If it was after he had been transferred to 3RTR, it is quite possible that it was at Mainneville which is a few miles north of the River Seine and which I know, again from discussions with Eric, was a particularly difficult time and also provides a good fit to your description (the Troop was badly knocked about with a number of casualties and they were necessarily bypassed by the rest of the Regiment meaning that they then had to catch up with the rest).

    Best Regards to you all
    Steve Pannell
     
  17. Annabolic

    Annabolic New Member

    Hi Steve

    Thank you for getting back to me.

    Yes it was a very difficult time for Eric. :(

    I have just heard that he has contacted the present Mayor of La Ferte and through him we maybe able to find out the location of the bakery anf the brave girl who lead him to safety from the enemy-occupied territory.

    I will certainly pass your wishes on to Eric and thanks again for your help

    Regards
    Anna
     
  18. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Anna

    I've sent you a PM (Personal Message).

    Steve.
     
  19. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Hi Steve,

    Intrigued at the mo. - was the regimental HQ of the 24th L at Cannock? And i.e. would it if it "were" still "theoretically" be there? I think that there was some building (but it's probably a school or a local govt. office or private house now I suppose?)

    Or could some route be tracked theoretically to some "existing" place or regiment for "relics" of the 24th L? No museum as such though I guess/suppose?

    I assume that such things might have been transferred - for example - to somewhere? I think it was mentioned somewhere in this thread that there was somewhere that kept things like examples of 24th regalia, kit etc. et al? Might be just IWM or Bovington now though I guess? i.e. as in: http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/54772-le-parc-de-bois-londe-boislonde/ on post # 16 ?

    In my own granddad's place I gather things are especially complex as I would track a route first from the 9th (to now whichever regiment they have become (9/12th I think) but also the 24th L (and where-ever their letterheads and fonts ended up ;) ) to the records of the SRY (which actually still exists B) ) and i'll probably have to visit at some stage, probably on a day when it will be... :mfr_closed2:

    All the best!

    Rm.
     
  20. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic Patron

    Rm

    24L were based at Cannock at one stage but then moved on.

    There is no descendant Regiment as such because 24L were a war raised Regiment only. Personnel were transferred to other Regiments when 24L were disbanded so no continuity that way either.

    The 'official' current location of 24L is c/o RAC Bovington but that is only for the purpose of former members of the Regiment requiring welfare assistance and I've never come across a case of anyone using that service.

    While there are a number of depositories of 24L 'bits and pieces', these are spread all over the place and there is consequently no Museum or space in someone else's Museum dedicated to 24L. Basically a dead end I'm afraid.......unless someone can enlighten me!

    This means only general research at the Tank Museum and the National Archive at Kew is likely to yield significant results. Nothing different with 24L compared to many other Regiments.

    .......and which is why it was so brilliant of Leonard Willis to write None Had Lances.......

    Happy hunting
    Steve
     

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