420 Sqn RCAF & Wellington LN431

Discussion in 'The War In The Air' started by Owen, Apr 16, 2006.

  1. Verrieres

    Verrieres no longer a member

    Hi Owen,
    I do`nt have anything specifically named to `your` crew however check these photographs from an ex member of 420 Squadron.
    RCAF 420 Snowy Owl Squadron

    sample posted but many more on this site;
    Regards
    Verrieres
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Verrieres

    Verrieres no longer a member

    Hi,
    Found this confirmation of death for the crew in 1944;
    FLIGHT magazine
    AUGUST 17TH, 1944

    PREVIOUSLY REPORTED MISSING, NOW PRE
    SUMED KILLED IN ACTION.—Sgt. J. F. A. Bailev-
    Sgt. P. S. Barnett; Sgt. E. N. N. Beldon- S«Y
    J. P. Belfield; Sgt. J . B. E. Birrell; Sgt. B ' c I
    Boyd; Sgt. D. D. Boyd; Sgt. H. Brown; Fit. Set
    C G. Carriugton; F/O. H. K. Coates; P / Q V
    Collins; Sgt. A. M. Cowgill; Sgt. F. G. Cowle. •
    Fit. Sgt. B. S. Cox; Sgt. W. G. H. Dadge- KM'
    F. W. Day; Sgt. D. H. Douglas; P/O. J . M. Dmv
    lop; Sgt. J. Erskine; Sgt. W. A Ewart; Set
    R. S. Faeey; Fit. Sgt. C. S. Field; Sgt. A M
    Finfer; F/O. J. Fort. D.F.C.; Sgt. P. Fowkr:
    Sgt. R. A. Freeman; Fit. Sgt. H. J. French1
    Sgt. L. Gardner; Sgt. II. ,1. Graham; Sgt. c'
    Haddock; Sgt. A. Harris; Sgt. J. Harris; Set
    W. Hattou; Fit. Sgt. V. Hill; Sgt. Jr"A. HobbV
    Sgt. L. J. Hopkins; Sgt. I. lllingworth; Sgt'
    W. B. Jamieson; F/O. M. P. Johnson; Sgt V
    Kelly, Sgt. G. Lee; Sgt. E. J. Lees; Fit.' hi
    D. M.' Leith-Hay-Clark; Sgt. R. A. Lewis; Set
    );. W. H. McNally; Sgt. W. P. Maher; Sgt, A. J
    Mason; F/O. R. J. Massie; Sgt N. J. Meen:
    Sgt. 8. T. Mills? Sgt. E. S. R. Norgrove; Sgt'
    J. Morris; Sgt. E. Moxen- Sgt. D J. Nettle-
    Fit. Sgt. V. Nicholson, D.F.M.; P/O. A T
    Parker; Sgt. J. M. Parr; Sgt. D. H. Pether; Set'
    J. C. P r a t t ; Fit. Sgt. D. R. H. Rees; Act. Gronn
    Capt. B. V. Robinson D.S.O., D.F.C., A F C -
    Sgt. J. H. Rodgers; Sgt. P. W. Shale; Sgt. H f
    Simmonds; Fit. Sgt. E. G. A. Sotheron-EstcourU
    Fit. Sgt. A. J. Stone; Sgt, J . M. StringfolKak
    P/O. J. Sutherst; Sgt. C. G. Tavlor- F O
    D. W. B. Taylor; Sgt. G Wallace; 'Sgt. D B
    Ward; F'O. Q B. Watt; F/O. J . A. Webb- Act
    Fit. Lt. II. Webster, D.F.C.; W/O. J. L. Welch'
    D.F.M.; F/O. R. J. Widdecombe; Sgt. L. H V
    Wiles; Sgt. E. J.s tWilliams; Sgt. R. Wilson
    Regards
    Verrieres
     
    Owen likes this.
  3. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Hello dboyd,
    I just love the internet at times like these.
    Glad I could help you with your knowledge of their deaths.
    I'm sure on the photo I took of panel 8 of the Malta Memorial is Davey's name.
    I'll check in the morning.

    Verrieres
    Cheers for link to 420 Sqn site, I 've seen that before.
    Thanks for the extract from flight magazine.
     
  4. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Been up loft and dug out my photos from 1994.
    Sorry they not brilliant because they are copied from the album .
    Originals were taken with my trusty old 35mm SLR.
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    I must look this up when I eventually get to The National Archives one day.

    AIR 49/262
    No. 420 Squadron, R.C.A.F.: reports
    1943 June- Sept.
     
  6. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Just had this from my Aussie cousin.
    Unfortunately image is abit small, hope he can resend it to me.

    The group of 3 is, Uncle Bill, Bill Couzins, & Les Hosking.

    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/war-air/11135d1229165430-420-sqn-rcaf-wellington-ln431-bill-jpg
     

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    • bill.jpg
      bill.jpg
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  7. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    With Adam's help I now have larger images.

    Bill Dadge
    [​IMG]


    Bill, Bill Couzins, & Les Hosking
    [​IMG]


    Bomber Aimers course, Saskatchewan.
    From what I can make out the caption says.
    Course 62L Air Bombers
    5 Bombing & Gunnery school
    Dafoe, Saskatchewan.

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  9. KevinBattle

    KevinBattle Senior Member

  10. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  11. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Been to the local Scouts HQ today so was able to get a photo of their War Memorial.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  13. Daithi

    Daithi Junior Member

    Here's a photo of my late father Sgt Boyd (taken in 1936). According to the back of the photo it's 'Sharia Kasr-el-nil, Cairo'

    Looking at the squadron photo in a previous post, there's a strong family resemblance between the third from the right (back row) and my eldest son - the family are 90% certain that's my father

    http://s1171.photobucket.com/albums/r550/gi7omy/?action=view&current=SgtBoyd.jpg


    http://s1171.photobucket.com/albums/r550/gi7omy/?action=view&current=DBoyd.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Cheers for those photos, good to put some faces to crew names.
    Wonder if we can get the whole crew on here?
    I like the casual fag smoking pose whilst mowing the lawn, heart not really in it.


    Images in post showing as a red X.
    When posting imagers from Photobucket use the IMG code in brackets like this .
    like this.
    [URL="http://i1171.photobucket.com/albums/r550/gi7omy/DBoyd.jpg[/IMG"]http://i1171.photobucket.com/albums/r550/gi7omy/DBoyd.jpg[/IMG[/URL]]


    [IMG][URL="http://i1171.photobucket.com/albums/r550/gi7omy/SgtBoyd.jpg"]http://i1171.photobucket.com/albums/r550/gi7omy/SgtBoyd.jpg[/URL]
     
  15. Daithi

    Daithi Junior Member

    I'm not really certain of his RAF history Owen - I know in the wedding photos he was an Aircraftsman (unclear if he was AC2 or AC1) as there were no rank markings on his sleeve (a LAC could have had a two-bladed propellor). When I arrived my birth cert has him as a corporal - he was an orderly room clerk and volunteered for aircrew afterwards (he said "Any WAAF can do my job")

    There are 40 bods in total in that squadron photo supplied by Verrieres - it's a fair bet that was the squadron aircrews (8 crews). Now the date that was taken could be interesting (and would help to confirm whether it was him or not)
     
  16. Daithi

    Daithi Junior Member

    I've been building models for more years than I care to recall and I've always wanted to build a flying) model of LN431 but could never find out the code letter. Worst case I'd go for 'Q' (the local uni student rag week magazione is 'PTQ' from the Belfast motto of 'Pro Tanto Quid Retribuamus) and I've always assumed that anyone with a sense of humour would have asked for that (for that reason)

    I sent Owen a link to the squadron Operational Record Books :

    August 3: Seventeen were detailed to attack San Paolo, Italy. One aircraft did not take off. All successfully bombed target and took pictures of bombing. Good visibility. Target illumination was used to identify target for bomb aimers. Bomb loads were 9x500. DF686 and LN431 carried a 4000 lb cookies.

    August 11: Ten aircraft again visited the beaches of Messina and Capo Peloro. Attack was good with many bomb blasts observed. Opposition was small amount of heavy and light flak. A further aircraft was sent on a nickelling run over the Leghorn and Pisa area. Bomb loads were either 6x250 plus 6 SBC (8x40) or 6x500. Take off time was ~19:50. Bombs were dropped ~22:25 from 5000 to 7500 feet. Target was identified visually in clear weather. Bomb bursts, fires and explosions seen. Defences were very limited. Some crews observed barges along the coast and went to low altitude to strafe them. The Lewington crew flying LN431 dropped 250000 nickels over the Leghorn/Pisa area.

    August 13: Stand down after eleven consecutive days of ops. Ground crews efforts were greatly appreciated for keeping the service level of the squadron up. F/L Gourlie (aka "Do-Do") reported as missing yesterday arrived back at the squadron. One of the bomber's engines caught fire after take off and crash landed 40 miles away. Only the ba F/O Nodder was injured. The last month saw many good movies shown on base. Crew rest camps are working well. Black out conditions imposed due to enemy aircraft in the area. Weather is hot and dusty. Squadron in good health with sickness less the 1%. Three replacement crews from the UK reported to the Wing. Two were assigned to 420 Squadron and the other to 424 Squadron. NASAF signalled Group that the efforts against the beaches of Messina and area were successful and greatly appreciated by the ground forces. Beaches in the areas of San Giovanni, Palmi and Pizzo were the target for tonight. 331 Wing was to send 25 bombers to operate against the San Giovanni and Palmi beaches. The target was well lit in the moonlight and five, 2000 lb cookies, were dropped with good effect on the targets. NASAF requested an fly exclusion zone around Catania, Augusta and Syracus

    August 14: On this night ops came through for fourteen aircraft were detailed to areas around Pizzo and Lamezia. One did not take off. Eleven bombers successfully attacked villages, railways, beaches and small boats in good visibility. Crews observed many fires. Two aircraft failed to return. Bomb loads for the attack were 6x250 plus 6x500 or 6SBC (8x40). One aircraft detailed to Larmezia carried a 4000 lb cookie. Take off times varied from 19:03 to 20:14. Attacks appeared to be successful with fires and explosions observed. Opposition was minimal. One crew over Pizzo reported what appeared to be plane crash. Two crews did not return: HE524: Pilot P/O AB Long, nav F/O E/I Fairweather, ba F/O A Brown, wop F/O CW Dickinson, ag Sgt WH Garbutt; and in LN431: Pilot Sgt JM Parr, nav Sgt DJ Nettle, ba Sgt WCH Dadge, wop Sgt ESR Norgrove, ag Sgt DD Boyd. All were killed. One crew was reported missing from the missions but were reported safe in Sicily after crashing their plane. 70 bombers were required to attack the beaches from Messina to Acqualadrone. These orders were cancelled and the beaches from San Giovanni to Palmi and the area of Pizzo were targeted instead. 25 crews from 331 Wing were detailed to attack the Pizzo target. Nineteen bombers succeeded in attacking the area with 32 tons of bombs. Fires were started in the towns and on the beaches. A barge was sunk with a direct hit. Two crews from 420 Squadron were reported missing. A signal was sent from Group asking night fighters to avoid target areas.

    RCAF 420 Snowy Owl Squadron North Africa
     
  17. Daithi

    Daithi Junior Member

    Reading tyhat over again I'm struck by the last line

    "Two crews from 420 Squadron were reported missing. A signal was sent from Group asking night fighters to avoid target areas."

    To me that sounds like some aircraft were attacked by our own night fighters - I could be wrong, but it does sound odd.
     
  18. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Blimey, I didnt twig that before either.
    Cheers
     
  19. Varasc

    Varasc Senior Member

    Very interesting topic, indeed. I really appreciated it, mainly because of my interest for this kind of bomber.
     
  20. Daithi

    Daithi Junior Member

    Blimey, I didnt twig that before either.
    Cheers

    Too late now to ask for a Court of Inquiry - I do know any time I ever tried asking for details about my father from the Air Ministry/MoD Historical Branch that they had no details. Possible cover-up and all evidence is missing?

    From elsewhere:

    "WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force):
    Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) P-38's sweep the toe of Italy
    but find little enemy movement. Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF)
    fighters, and medium and light bombers hit a refueling depot at Nicola and near
    Gesso, Sicily, a road junction N of Palmi, Italy, shipping in the straits and
    along the W coast of Italy N to Gioia, and numerous targets of opportunity in
    NE Sicily and S Italy"

    Also 255 Squadron RAF was operating Beufighters in the area

    Duty

    1940-1942: Defensive night fighter, home based

    1942-1943: Night fighter, North Africa

    1943: Night fighter, Sicily

    1943-1945: Night intruder over Balkan from Italy
     

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