52nd Lowland Division

Discussion in 'NW Europe' started by Borderer, Jan 4, 2022.

  1. Borderer

    Borderer Junior Member

    Awesome account, thank you!

    Any chance you could do a similar account of 52nd Lowlands part in the battle :salut:


    Mod edit: These few following posts moved from stolpi 's 51st Div thread.
     
    stolpi and Chris C like this.
  2. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    I know someone on Twitter who is mad keen on 52nd Lowland Division. I should try to entice him to join us here and do threads like this for the 52nd. :)
     
    Bowlesy and MongoUK like this.
  3. Borderer

    Borderer Junior Member

    That would be great. The exploits of the 52nd Lowland Division, from extensive mountain training in Scotland, to the amphibious assault onto Walcheren and onwards to Bremen is a remarkable tale indeed :flagscot:
     
    IanTS, Bowlesy and Chris C like this.
  4. Wapen

    Wapen Well-Known Member

    Good plan. Suck him in!
     
    Chris C likes this.
  5. Bowlesy

    Bowlesy Member

    HEAR, HEAR. I am new to this site & have had brilliant responses to my first few posts as I am so eager to find out all I can about the division, especially about the Military Policemen that were seconded to them during the Walcheren campaign. My Father had a stroke & died before I could speak with him properly about his movements so still not sure which company he was in of 155 Brigade. I didn't appreciate what the poor souls went through, especiallynon the Causeway. So, so brave. Encourage your friend to share what he knows, the knowledge is priceless!! Thank you
     
    Wapen and Chris C like this.
  6. Andy Ait

    Andy Ait New Member

    Who’s that the ?
     
    MongoUK and Chris C like this.
  7. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    Oooh, I wonder. Welcome, Andy!!!
     
  8. Bowlesy

    Bowlesy Member

    Hello Andy,

    Are you the 52nd Div 'mad keen' guy. Why the 52nd?? What are your connections?

    Cheers,

    Bowlesy
     
  9. Andy Ait

    Andy Ait New Member

    I have a mild interest.
    Not sure what you mean by connections?
    War diaries, published literature etc?
     
  10. Bowlesy

    Bowlesy Member

    Hi Andy,

    Thanks for taking the time & trouble to reply, very much appreciated.

    I wondered if you were intested in the 52nd Division because, maybe, you had a relative who served with them. I would certainly be interested to know if you can give hints, tips or recommend books (I do have quite a few already) diaries etc. that could help anyone like me (ignorant, novice) trying to piece together someone's war record. I have had some great help & advice from you guys & have read some brilliant accounts on here but as the song goes 'there are more questions than answers & the more I find out the less I know'.

    Because my Father's life during his time as a Corporal in the Corps of Military Police Provost Division with the 52nd Lowland Division during 1942-1952 represented a whole previous life, including a first wife & a 'liaison' somewhere in Holland after the liberation, my Mother never let him talk about it. He needed to & should have done but he was never allowed to & I know the memories of what he had seen & been through haunted him for the rest of his life.

    Now retired myself & 'the old boy' gone for many years it is only now I have the time to research his history. I had often wanted to sit down with him to make some notes with actual dates & names but a brain tumour & stroke managed to get to him before I could. To my shame, I know nothing about the structure of the British Army so get quite confused by all I read.

    Thanks again & with best regards.

    Chriss
     
  11. John Costello

    John Costello Member

    For anyone interested in the 52nd Lowland Division the book “Mountain and Flood” is well worth a read. Copies are available on Amazon or EBay. I only read it after having read the Regimental history of the Cameronians and it was very interesting to look at the campaign from both a divisional level as well as a Battalion level. Dad was in the 7th Cameronians and like many others I wished I had asked more questions whilst he was alive.
     
  12. IanTS

    IanTS Member

    Hi Chriss,

    I'm a bit late posting this but I wanted to say it was such a shame to lose your dad that way. It's surprising what they went through and is so difficult to comprehend when they tell you. My dad was in the 52nd too, 4th Batt KOSB. They trained as mountain troops and took part in the Battle of the Scheldte, some of the lowest lying land.
    I was lucky to be able to video my dad telling some of his stories, which he only spoke about in later years. He died at age 95, with so much more to tell.
    He said that he had buried a lot of his buddies, some being friends from the same village.

    He also said he took two years to "get over it", although they never really did. He had tears in his eyes when he spoke about the loss of his friends.

    I think it's a wonderful thing to remember all those who fought for our freedom and to talk of the respect we have for them.

    Ian.
     
    Chris C likes this.
  13. IanTS

    IanTS Member

  14. Andy Ait

    Andy Ait New Member

    Hi Ian
    Fascinating story, I am currently specifically researching 4 KOSB, I’d love to hear more about your father.
    Thanks, Andy
     
  15. IanTS

    IanTS Member

    Hi Andy,

    Did you have a look at the Milsurps thread, that will give you a reasonable impression. Have you read "With the Jocks"?

    I'll put some things together in the hope that it helps you. I've got to shoot off but hopefully I'll get some stuff on here tonight.

    Ian.
     
  16. Andy Ait

    Andy Ait New Member

    I have indeed, thanks Ian. Look forward to it
     
  17. IanTS

    IanTS Member

    Hi Andy,

    I suppose a photo of him towards the end of the war would be a start. He is also seventh from the right in the second row.
    . dad2crop.jpg KOSB 4th Bat A Coy 2a.jpg
    Dad joined the Territorials in 1937, he lied about his age. He gave his year of birth as 1919, it was 1920.
    As you probably noted, he was a sergeant sniper and had eight snipers under his wing, they were 4th Batt. snipers, there were about fifty in the regiment.
    He was in A Coy and then HQ Coy after he became a sergeant sniper. He applied along with a friend to join the Commando, but they wouldn't let him go as he was their small arms and explosives instructor.

    His first experience of the war was when he was part of the second expeditionary force, he said that they were still out there when Churchill announced the completion of the withdrawal from Dunkirk. They trained as mountain troops and was stationed at Banchory for some of that time. You would have heard his story of the salmon fishing on the river Dee and his poaching exploits. He was a great poacher.

    My parents split up after the war and I don't remember seeing my father back then. He remarried and went to Canada in 1951. He came to the UK to find me in 1976, that's when I found out I had a brother and sister. I know there were lots more stories he could tell. I had intended to video more of them in 2016, but he died before I got there.

    He was in the Battle of the Scheldt, and he said he was the first of the KOSB to step ashore at Flushing, behind No4 Commando.

    One of his stories was he was sent out to assassinate Rommel. I had intended to get more detail from him, but I was too late. I checked out dates once I got his service record and it couldn't have been Rommel as he was dead. I can only think that they weren't aware of Rommel's death at that time. He set off and I'm sure he had one of his snipers with him. The location where they were to intercept the German officer's car was a bridge, he said they were three hours too late. I don't know where this was, but it must have been behind German lines.

    I have to go now, but I will see what else might be of interest.

    Ian
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2022
    Chris C likes this.
  18. JohnnyfB

    JohnnyfB New Member

    Hi everybody on this thread. I just joined this forum because I saw this thread searching for KOSB on the internet. My name is John and I live in Flushing (Vlissingen), Holland.

    I want to let you all know that each year around November 1st, we commemorate the liberation of Walcheren. We're stil very grateful to those who contributed to our liberation. This saturday there wil be the annual commemoration and wreath laying. And on tuesday we remember one of No 4 Commando veterans who recently past away.

    We feel strongly connected to all forces that took part in the Walcheren campaign. For me personnaly, it is the KOSB (as a former drummer in the Inter Scaldis Pipeband, I had the honour to join the annualy Minden Day parade at Berwick upon Tweed. Nowadays I'm often present on several commemorations on my 1942 BSA WM20 motorcycle, badged 4th Battalion KOSB).

    With respect to all your relatives who contributed to a free Europe,

    John
     
  19. IanTS

    IanTS Member

    Thanks for your kind words John. I attended the big liberation celebration and was made very welcome by the people of Flushing with a special welcome from Bevrijdingsmuseum Zeeland. Anyone who visits the area really should visit the museum.

    I was also looking for more information on the KOSB, particularly on the 4th Battalion. I came across the war diaries of the 4th Battalion on this site,
    https://www.royalscotskosbwardiaries.co.uk very interesting once you have cracked most of the abbreviations. There is reference to the mine accident, where 30+ Royal Engineers together with HQ coy members were blown up, including the snipers, my father was lucky, he wasn't there as he was sent back from the front, suffering from pneumonia.

    The book "With The Jocks", written from the diary of Peter White after his death, tells the story from the Scheldt on.

    Ian.
     
  20. IanTS

    IanTS Member

    Here are a couple of photos of a cigarette case in which my father scratched the names of the places he went through advancing into Germany
    . Cigcase1a.jpg Cigcase2a.jpg
    I have a typed version of the place names to make it easier to read. Click on the title of the file to download.

    Ian.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 30, 2022
    Chris C likes this.

Share This Page