A tank a day keeps Politicians at bay.

Discussion in 'The Barracks' started by von Poop, Nov 1, 2019.

  1. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

    Adopted by Britain prior to 1914. Some purchased privately by volunteer units particularly cyclist battalions. Fitted to Mk I heavy tanks in 1916 but replaced with the Lewis in Mks II III & IV. Reinstated on the Mk V and Mk V* in 1918
  2. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin


    Bullock Creeping Grip... with Elephant Legs.

    More proto-tank.
    Nope, never quite worked it out.
    Apparently in Burton during 1915.
    The Bullock was another US machine, considered at the same time as the Holt.
    Legs doubtless to assist in trench crossing, though whether hinder is a better word; lord knows.
    Propping, swinging, dunno. Quite tempted to build it in Knex to see just how it might move over a ditch.
    Have a feeling I might have something more written down about it... somewhere. But again, that might just be my addled brain.

    Whatever. It's glorious.
    We can laugh, but these are serious chaps using serious government money to solve a new problem. Prepared to test anything.
    Tritton was there in Burton it seems, but he got everywhere...

    13529056_10154347628292139_8239027746522408819_n.jpg 13533022_10154347966622139_6342449955321983513_n.jpg 13537620_10154347966817139_744424739411628661_n.jpg 58384c1c8d097_CGEletrackinditch.jpg.22645cdf872a8501feef1f59c994ca39.jpg

    Look at the wheels!
    creep.jpg Image24.jpg

    And if you ever need to creep up on a baby, maybe to kiss it in front of television cameras... shudder...:

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  3. canuck

    canuck Token Colonial Patron

    Meanwhile, Adam is busy with his Christmas shopping.

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  4. Vintage Wargaming

    Vintage Wargaming Well-Known Member

    Lucky they put those two bungees on it
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  5. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

    A number of American track systems were considered., however despite a significant and largely mendacious publicity/advertising campaign Holts was never seriously considered for the British tanks. The Killen system was tested first and then the Bullock. The Bullock system was fitted to the Lincoln No1 which was the world's first true tank. However the tracks kept slipping off and were replaced by one of Tritton's own designs. The revised machine was nicknamed Little Willy. The same type of Tritton track was used on the first rhomboid tanks which had absolutely no suspension sytem. The Holt system was based on the British Ruston patent that had been sold to Holt. It did form the basis of the French Schneider and St Chamond tanks and the German A7V and proved entirely inadequate for use in shelled areas. What it did do was contribute greatly to British logistics capability in the form of half track tractors. At one time the main British supply route into Italy was dependent on large numbers of Holts towing trains of tracked trailers. Without similar support Allenby would have been unable to fight the battle of Beersheba or support the subsequent advance on Jerusalem.
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  6. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Old Hickory Recon

    von Poop What is the speed limit when transporting a side-mounted AFV on British highways?
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  7. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Lorries are restricted to 56 mph .
    I remember the days when we could do 70.
  8. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA Patron

    How did they get it in there, I wonder?
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  9. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

    Yep so do I - and the bullies on the motorways
  10. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin


    The Australian Cruiser (Sentinel)

    Long way to Oz from established makers of Tanks, not so far from Japan.
    Seemed wise to get something indigenous sorted & nobody wants to be another Bob Semple (stop laughing. I've some sympathy with that thing). The Aussies made rather a decent fist of it.
    Reminiscent of a Cruiser on steroids. Made with Africa in mind.
    I know everyone always mentions its Impressive use of castings, but they really were a big deal. To produce large castings like that isn't exactly easy anyway, but to make them armoured as well was pretty cutting-edge for the time, particularly in a country with no history of tank production.
    Never went to war, but proved useful for training etc., & they don't seem to have completely stopped developing it with assorted tests up to 17pdr (with one 'recoil test' machine mounting twin 25pdrs). Not so many British designs originating in 1941 would adapt so well to such 'expansion' of armament.

    It also has a hilarious 'thingy' dangling off the front as an MG shroud.
    Those Aussies, eh...

    There's a book on it that's possibly worth a look, though I haven't yet as I didn't much like the author's other foray into armoured things:
    Fallen Sentinel

    Far too many pictures of AC 1-4, because the Australian War Memorial site is frankly F awesome.
    Must dig about in there some more. Not been for ages & it's now very slick indeed.

    (There was one blurry shot of the 17pdr setup that was all we saw for a long time. Nice to have clear pictures showing that a lot of work was done on the turret.)


    4118135.JPG 4118134.JPG 4126112.JPG 3806912.JPG AC_E1(AWM_P03498.010).jpg thz3n373opu21.jpg 3806913.JPG 3825413.JPG 4119693.JPG 3937529.JPG 4089428.JPG ead22503974c1e0a3c0667d71b8da96e.jpg RAAC-AC1-tank.jpg
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  11. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

    You didn't include my favourite. The Sentinel with twin 25 pounders in the turret initially as a test bed for 17 pounder recoil but considered for bunker busting.
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  12. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    Ooooh yes I did.

    That two (apparently unbraked) simultaneous 25 pdrs gave only c.20% more recoil than a 17pdr possibly tells us a good deal about the 17 being a bit of a beast...
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  13. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin


    Armoured Bulldozers (And Crawlers).

    Something the Germans never quite grasped.
    It's never all about the gun tank, & something with real low-down grunt capable of making pathways through wrecked cities, clearing road blockages, etc. etc. etc. is a significantly useful military asset. Particularly if it can operate under a bit of armour.
    While Germany did field a few conversions, and knocked out several specials to clear rubble in bombed areas; the Allies had this aspect completely nailed down.
    First among all: The armoured Caterpillar D7, (which I think of regularly while lacing my boots :unsure:). I can be hypnotised by the sheer size & power of an un-armoured D7 at a show - that something 75 years old can still demonstrate such effortless strength is a tribute to the designers & makers. Bung a bit of armour on & you've got a winner.

    All very well to strap a blade to the front of a particular tank (IIRC the UK's longest serving afv in the British army was a Cent AVRE called 'Fosgene', recently up for sale), but hard to beat a properly dedicated machine.

    As for non-dozer armoured crawlers & other extemporisations - who can blame 'em?
    Very powerful & capable (if slow) off-road machines crying out for militarisation.

    Not that it's just the military. The lunatic Mr Heemayer's Coloradan rampage showed just what destruction a carefully modified Bulldozer can do.
    Certainly more effective than most stolen tanks seem to have managed.

    Ridiculous slew of images, because the subject is frankly massive.
    Probably shouldn't have chosen it for a tank a day, but there you go.

    My new favourite armour image:

    d7 k2.jpg Annotation 2019-12-05 191624.jpg alan-turner-bulldozer-001.jpg 22223534799_e34d17a084_o.jpg dozer 1.jpg 59dcd48d8f611_DozerRN.jpg.1eebd82bb6d6ec8900ac508506d20150.jpg holt_5-ton_artillery_tractor.jpeg hol.jpg Holt_SPGs_3.jpg dozerframe_000.jpg daa14cf61d7fc2b447c4774f488f921d.jpg ixWBAHW-x.jpg
    This is Strang, in case you were wondering:

    armored-bulldozer.jpg IWM-MH-9862-Crusader-gun-tractor.jpg IWM-MH-9861-Alecto-dozer.jpg Nuremberg.jpg 6f993e32985f2957c115fed283de2b3a.jpg 7989f7add6280011b1aea26226d2ecb8.jpg 1200px-20060714_defile_blindes_p1040887.jpg fr.jpg 1280px-Trojan_AVRE_in_Helmand,_Afghanistan_MOD_45151228.jpg qbybqpf4ap301.jpg Trojan_AVRE_-_Tankfest_2009.jpg

    Annotation 2019-12-05 194220.jpg
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  14. canuck

    canuck Token Colonial Patron

    Can't exclude the iconic 1964 Tonka.

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  15. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA Patron

    Bulldozer to Sherman, "Hold my beer."

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  16. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin



    Yeah, maybe not really tanks again, but delightful nonetheless, and some are tanks. So there.

    That 'What is a tank?' thing writ large.
    These tank things are damned slow, and these armoured cars bog down so easily.
    What if we somehow built the best of both worlds? Wheels for roads & tracks for off-road?

    That's genius, sir. This is the future of warfare, & nobody at all will find them over-complex curiosities only of interest to the nerdishly inclined & lovers of strange engineering.

    So many different approaches, from the steering wheels of early tanks proper, to luxury saloons.
    All doomed.
    All brilliant.

    938c73051f9458ffb2d42808fec6b370.jpg 12068415_1201694663179995_6965792989486776282_o.jpg adg9.jpg Annotation 2019-12-07 001901.jpg 16a Mar 2015 .jpg 7517329f4c80f7be168ff8620825079c.jpg DkvhoUxXcAAvE8J.jpg adm1.jpg 9rbCrBC.jpg 10TP_8b2.jpg vickers_d3e1_8.jpg 16b Mar 2015.jpg

    D'you think we might have gone too far this time, sir?
    That it might just be a little too complicated?
    Nonsense, Sven. Even the most simple & mechanically inept soldier will find it a breeze to keep running smoothly!
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  17. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA Patron

    I hope you are enjoying putting these posts together as much as I am enjoying looking at them.
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  18. canuck

    canuck Token Colonial Patron

    Variations on that theme continue today.

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  19. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

  20. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

    Also missed the KH 50
    Kolohousenka - Tank Encyclopedia

    However the Poles did produce a form of wheeled tank combination that worked. This combined a railway low loader and an FT7 tank with a drive taken off the tank to the railway wheels creating an armoured drasine. This could zip along at just under 30 mph and on reaching the area of conflict the tank component just drove off the end of the low loader. These operated in pairs as scouts for armoured trains. I don't know if any saw action in 1939. The Poles applied the same approach to the trailer component of a road low loader to produce a self propelled tank transporter but obviously also had to add steering..

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