Richard. Your uncle may well have been killed just prior to the assault that Stu mentions and shows the map for above. The original plan for the passage of lines through 5 Cdn Armd Div by 4 BR Inf Div, and scheduled for 1800 hrs on 13 Sep 44, was delayed until early on 14 Sep 44 because 12 Inf Bde, whilst assembling in the dry bed of the River Besanigo, came under such heavy and accurate shell fire that organising a strong attack was quite impossible. The only cover for the attackers were ploughed fields, vegetable patches and low vines – which is not much. You can see the River Besanigo on Stu's map. Regards Frank
Richard. Here is a photo of the Pian dell Piave objective that 12 Inf Bde was required to secure. 6 BW focussed on Casa Fabri. It was taken from Ospedaletto at the bridge over the River Marano which, at the time was in German hands. The bridge is shown on Stu's map. Regards Frank
Richard. 6 BW were at Cassino for the Fourth Battle in May 44 although they arrived in Apr and spent time just holding ground in various part of the front line. 12 Infantry Brigade, to which 6 BW belonged, were the 4 Infantry Division's reserve for the Fourth Battle and were committed once the Amazon Bridge had gone in on 13 May 44. Their task was to break into the Liri Valley. After the fall of Rome on 5 Jun 44, 4 Infantry Division moved up to Tivoli and skirted round Rome. One of the other battalions in 4 Infantry Division was 1/6 East Surreys. Where they went, 6 BW largely went. Here are 1/6 East Surreys movements from Jun-Dec 44. Regards Frank
Morning Frank Thank you for your responses, information and sharing your knowledge. I have my unles personal diary, so i think I will try to see if theres anything I have missed and try tie it in with the information provided. I will at the start of next year apply for his service record and see if there is any further info .... I may also look into the feasibility of a visit/tour and to attend his grave (as its only been visited once since his death) once the current health implications level out. Is there an option within your tours to tie in or even have a tailored visit/tour if I were already in Italy?? Many thanks again to you,Stu and everyone who has provided information, I am eternally grateful...( now onto the mystery uncle who was at Dunkirk, may have served in tanks and may or may not have been in Normandy.....but thats a lot harder!!!!)...have a great Sunday everyone.
Hi Frank His name was Edwin Smith a corporal ( family gossip is he did gain a higher rank but didnt manage to keep the rank!!) his service number was 2987101. I think he served with th Argylls prior to the 6th.
Dickyboy. I see that Edwin Smith is buried at Gradara. That is some way behind what was the front line at the time so that tells me that he was wounded and evacuated by 159 Field Ambulance RAMC. If he had been killed on the River Besanigo shelling incident then he would have been centralised at Coriano Ridge CWGC. I go to Gradara as part of my Gothic Line battlefield study. It sits on the side of a hill and is laid out in a curve with terracing. It is quite one of the most beautiful in Italy with Gradara castle towering over it. Sadly, the motorway now runs right next to it with ruins it a bit. Regards Frank
Yes heis buried at Gradara, It has bothered me since I found out about Edwin that he was buried there, my mother never ever spoke about him and any time I mentioned it I was stopped instantly...My father always always told me he was killed at cassino and the distance from ther made even less sense. I only found out he had been killed around the Coriano area by chance when Istumbled Black Watch Roll of honour. Would he have been evacuated by 159 if he was assaulting rather than assembling?..I have a few years ago had a chat with a gentleman through a FB page Battle of Monte Cassino who indicated Edwin may have been killed on an assault of the Coriano ridge involving a sqn of Churchill tanks...would there be any basis to this ??
Logically, I think the date he died should indicate where he died, since it would indicate where his regiment was operating
Hi Chris . I fully agree and i'm in no way doubting Frank or Stu, I am just seeking clarification. All this is reletively new to me and i'm trying as an amatuer to work out and follow the various maps and knowledge that have been so willingly supplied. I am wondering if the person who I spoke to on FB had the wrong hill/Monte as it was named Monte Coriano which doesn't appear on either of the maps provided and Frank has a considerable knowledge and experience of the conflict in this area......Sorry if I appear to be doubting or if I have caused any offence this isn't my intention. Richard
No worries Chris...Your reply got me thinking that my response did appear a little bit rude. Glad it hasn't have a great evening/day Richard
Here's his concentration form dowloaded from cwgc.org and also part of Sheet 109. I've indicated Misano using the map reference on the concentration form. Vitellino
Sorry, I hadn't read all of the thread. The battle of Cassino ended three months earlier, so your father was mistaken, I think. Coriano and Cassino do sound somewhat alike - that might be where the confusion came in.
Richard. Coriano is a ridge rather than a hill/mountain. As Janet has discovered, he was initially buried in Misano which is just behind the location in front of Pian dell Piave where 6 BW were badly shelled as they formed up on the night of 13-14 Sep to assault. He would have been evacuated by stretcher bearers to the Regimental Aid Post and from there by 159 Fd Amb RAMC to a Casualty Clearing Station or Advanced Dressing Station. A CSS or ADS was the first point at which surgery could be performed once the medics had reduced the trauma. He may well have died there. Misano is too far back for an RAP which tended to be very close behind the troops in the assault. I am still mystified why he was centralised at Gradara rather than Coriano. Coriano would seem closer and there was plenty of room. Regards Frank
Good morning Vitelino. Thanks for posting the info, I have a few questions I wonder if you or any other members can answer... 1. Where and what does ICGR stand for in rthe previously buried section of the index card? 2. likewise for the CROSS in reburied ( Iam presuming it refersto a location at Gradara. Thanks once again for taking the time to share I am very grateful. Richard
Richard. That six figure grid reference is in a field right next to a road. That would be right. Regards Frank
Richard, The cross is in the IDENTITY secion of the concentration form. This indicates that when the Grave Registration Unit went to collect him, his temporary grave, and indeed that of the others, was indicated by a cross. These were white wooden crosses made by the Pioneers attached to the casualties' military unit whose job it was to make sure as far as possible that all the fallen could be identified at a later date. You'll see that one soldier's grave was also indicated by his disc - I don't know where this was placed. I have attached a photo of what these crosses looked like - this is of Assisi War Cemetery. Had you considered contacting cwgc to ask them why the men from 6 BW were brought in to Gradara rather than into Coriano Ridge? My contact there has just retired, otherwise I could have asked today and would have received a reply tomorrow Vitellino
Richard. Here is GR 923860 on the ground at Misano. The house could well have been the ADS or CCS. Regards Frank
