The Centaur tank never made it into full field service with the RAC because of poor mechanical performance. The engine was a reportedly improved version of the Nuffield Liberty, but it still failed to meet requirements. I have read a pre-OVERLORD comparative test of the Sherman, Cromwell, and Centaur which was pretty scathing about the last named. Some Centaurs, nonetheless, saw active service in some form. The most famous such case was that of the Royal Marine Centaur IV CS tanks, which landed on June 6th with the assault divisions. Other Centaurs were used as OP tanks, dozers, AA tanks, etc. Are there any reports extant about the mechanical performance of these Centaurs in the field?
1st Canadian Centaur Battery, RCA Although short lived in Canadian Service, you can see in this short history, that in the 1 month the Centaur’s were used by the Canadian’s, at one point the Unit was down to 1 Sherman, 2 Centaur’s and 1 Cromwell mainly due to mechanical breakdowns. (Note: Cromwell had been “borrowed” from a Recce unit) The Battery had a HQ and Three Troops, each Troop having 1 Sherman OP, 4 x Centaurs Of the three Sherman Observation Post Tanks, and 12 x 95-millimetre Centaur IVs, that 1st Canadian Centaur Battery had originally taken over from “X” Armoured Battery, Royal Artillery, only one Sherman Observation Post Tank (Census No. T149788), and four 95-millimetre Centaur IVs (Census Numbers T185007, T185107, T185373, and T185387) were in serviceable and operational condition when turned into 259 Delivery Squadron, Royal Armoured Corps (the ‘Corps’ delivery squadron for 1st British Corps), on 4 September 1944. These five vehicles were duly turned over to “F” Squadron, 25th Canadian Armoured Delivery Regiment (The Elgin Regiment), Canadian Armoured Corps (the ‘Army’ delivery squadron for First Canadian Army), on 5 September 1944, from where they were returned to the applicable Ordnance facility. The remaining two Sherman Observation Post Tanks, and eight 95-millimetre Centaur IVs, having been struck-off-charge of 1st Canadian Centaur Battery, were in various workshops throughout the 1st British Corps area, undergoing repairs, of one sort or another. 1st Canadian Centaur Battery, RCA
Basically by the time the Centaur went into action in June 1944 it had been developed to have a service life (i.e. life between overhauls) of 2000 miles, as against the mandated service life for British Cruiser and Medium tanks of 3000 miles, which was achieved by the Cromwell and Sherman, and later the Comet. It should however, be noted that 2000 miles was in excess of the expected service life of a Panzer IV (around 1200 miles) and the Panther, whose attained service mileage varied depending on the variant, but was generally low. 2000 miles was however considered acceptable for AFV's employed outside of armoured regiments, such as SP guns and Infantry tanks, which is why the Centaur IV was deemed suitable for the Royal Marines. Therefore the Centaur was likely considerably more durable (and therefore reliable) than any German tank it may have encountered. Althought the Centaurs employed by the 1st Centauir Battery RCA during August were reported to have frequently fallen out, from what I can tell, these were generally problems with the steering and brakes, which were to the same design as employed on the Cromwell. I haven't seen any reports that suggest that the components that were unique to the Centaur (i.e. Liberty engine, clutch, idler adjusting mechanisms) had been prone to failure, so I would suggest that the failures encountered were due to wear and tear and lack of maintenance rather than any particular fault with the Centaur. With regard to this, it should be noted that in their employment with the RM, RA and RCA, the Centaurs were not being used by trained tank crews (with the exception of the RAC drivers), nor were they provided with an LAD or administrative tail, this being because they had only been originally intended for use in the initial assault on D-Day. So pending further evidence otherwise, I would say that the Centaur in 1944 was a reasonably reliable tank for its era, with its breakdowns probably being due to the poor standard of maintenance and spares shortages inherent in its employment in improvised units.
Very enlightening responses, thanks to both of you. They help me with a silly project I am working on (notional WWII Allied army).
A couple of observations on the report above posted by Temujin. The first is that the fact that five Centaurs fell out on 22nd August with steering and brake issues on one journey tends to suggest that these failures were due to worn brake and steering brake linings. This would not have happened in an armoured regiment, as the linings would have been periodically checked by the unit fitters and/or the LAD. Also in an armoured regiment the aforementioned facilities would have been available to replace the linings, while in the case of the various improvised units that used the Centaur, any repair would have had to have been undertaken in workshops, thereby generating the erroneous impression that the Centaur was workshop prone. The second observation is that the report lists the weapons available on the Centaur, claiming that "Anti-aircraft protection was provided by twin Vickers machine guns." If this statement is true, it suggests that these Centaurs had been fitted with PLM mountings, and so would have been the only British tanks in NWE that utilised this equipment. I can't tell you how much this possibility excites me.
I have their war diaries, and have posted them on another website (Wartimes.ca)…….not sure if they would help but here’s a link to the information (WD’s are at the bottom of link) 1st Canadian Centaur Battery, Royal Canadian Artillery - WARTIMES.ca FOLLOW UP…….here’s the Unit’s War Diaries (and other info, including a Manual for the Centaur) on Hertiage Canadiana website War diaries : T-16871 - Héritage On same site, direct link to Manual for Cromwell Series Tanks including Centaur War diaries : T-16871 - Héritage And if you keep reading after the Manual, a “pages and pages” of Ballistic Data And the link to Crew Duty Card War diaries : T-16871 - Héritage
AND, a side note……..in the Same Reel is War Diaries of 1st Canadian Rocket Unit, RCA War diaries : T-16871 - Héritage Just thought I would throw that in, these specific reels have a lot of info on “smaller RCA units”
[QUOTE="Don Juan, post: 954617, member: 46575] The second observation is that the report lists the weapons available on the Centaur, claiming that "Anti-aircraft protection was provided by twin Vickers machine guns." If this statement is true, it suggests that these Centaurs had been fitted with PLM mountings, and so would have been the only British tanks in NWE that utilised this equipment. I can't tell you how much this possibility excites me. [/QUOTE] (Sorry, I'm totally unsure of why the quote is broken here) If the tanks had them, they must have been added after D-Day as the photos of that time don't show them. Tantalisingly, the war diary Temujin linked says "26 August 1944: 3 Centaurs in action plus 1 Cromwell belonging to Arm'd Recce which fired by field clino and a few bow and arrow devices. Newsreel pictures taken of the guns firing." I'm a little puzzled by what a newsreel picture is - a photograph, or film? It might just be worth watching the Canadian newsreels from that period to see if they were included. (These are all on youtube) Then again, the footage might very well not have been used
The PLM mounting was a standard fitting for the Cromwell and Centaur (and also the A30 Challenger) that was initiated as part of a general programme during 1943 in the anticipation of heavy enemy air activity in the event of an invasion of NWE. The requirement for PLM mountings was cancelled sometime in late '43 or early '44 when it became clear that that particular threat was not going to materialise, although I assume the fittings for mounting the PLM were still being installed in the factory, and so the conversion in the field may have been relatively easy. There might be some detail on this in any war diary or reports compiled by 'X' Armoured Battery RA, although I am not aware if any such documents exist, and if they do where they might be, as a quick search on the National Archives Discovery site does not give any obvious leads.
Do you suppose there might be anything in these? CAB 106/1147 CAB 106/1148 ADM 202/304 ADM 202/305 ADM 202/306 CAB 104/1140 is here but has no info on machine guns Royal Marines Armoured Support Group in Operation Overlord
I doubt it because they are all RMASG files, while X Battery were with 6th Airborne Division, but you never know... Annoyingly, the general RA file for 6 Airborne Div. in 1944, which is WO 171/427, does not appear to cover June to Sept.
The RMASG did not receive the Centaurs because they were anon RAC Unit. The received them because the original concept was to use the hulks. (Centaurs minus engines) on LCTs to provide fire support on the run-in shoot. The hulks were to be landed in the surf for a one off mission on D Day. The British Armed Forces did not consider the Centaur to be a battleworthy AFV. The Royal Marines and soldiers assigned to man them begged and fought to be allowed to land as AFVs. I don't know what REME was assigned to the Canadian batteyr or X Battery,. but someone would have been on call. This was a favoured unit. HQ Artillery Second Army had a very soft spot for the RMASG. The dismal serviceability of the Centaurs in Op Paddle reflects the poor serviceability opf the vehicle. It is why there are two remaining on the Normandy beachhead.
I have a number of FVPE field trial reports that indicate that the Liberty engined Centaur was good for 2000 miles. I also have an FVPE field trial report for the Centaur fitted with a Ford V8 that demonstrated that it was good for 3000 miles and as reliable as the Cromwelll. The ONLY limitnig factor with the Centaur was the LIberty engine and especially its clutch. The clutch was problematic because as the Liberty was a longer engine than the Meteor, the clutch plates had to be narrower, and to a certain extent weaker, but this problem had largely been ameliorated by early 1944. If the components that failed on the Centaur were those components that were common to the Cromwell, then simple logic would indicate that the cause was not endemic to the Centaur, BECAUSE THE CENTAUR WAS NOTHING MORE THAN A CROMWELL WITH A LIBERTY ENGINE. It wasn't, as you seem to think, a special and distinct design infected with some sort of magical and mysterious crapness. Of course you don't know. If you had bothered to read the report posted by Temujin upthread you would have seen that 1st Centaur Battery RCA had been alloted a single REME gun fitter.
1200 miles?? It would be nice: such intervals could only be kept in peacetime. At the front one counted on a daily operational readiness of about 40 - 50% - with the quite reliable MkIII, IV and StuG A tank veteran (shot down 7 times on MK III/IV) once told me quite sarcastically that Panther and Tiger units had such moderate personnel losses because their tanks were sitting around in the workshop most of the time with technical defects.... regards Olli
6th Airborne REME Workshop war diary: The 6th Airborne Division in Normandy 21st August 1944 Place: Le Plein LAD 148 RAC a "C" type LAD with officer, reported to wksp having come under comd CREME 6 A/B Div, to assist in heavy recovery work anticipated in the Div advance. One Ward la France and 1 Austin 3 ton recovery veh. attached to Wksp from 33 Hy Rec. Coy and No.1 Rec. Coy. 26th August 1944 Place: Reux A large amount of work was brought in from DBP including 3 Centaur tanks, one of them was put on the road, the other 2 will have to be backloaded to an armoured wksp. Capt Bland was evacuated to 32 C.C.S. with suspected jaundice. Considerable trouble has been experienced with the 2 generator trailers, the 8 H.P. Austin engine will not stand up to constant running, spares have been demanded, including a spare engine but do not appear to be available. Both have now broken down, and in order to supply power to work the machinery a Jeep engine has been coupled to the generator trailer. A 4 KW generator has also been obtained from OFP. Received warning order that wksp would be returning to U.K. on about 2 Sept. PegasusArchive only contains the war diary narratives for the workshop. It would be interesting to see if there were any appendices that described the work carried out. A few of the armoured brigade workshops contain such details. I'll see if I can work out which armoured workshop is referred to here - must have been 1 Corps Troops I would have thought. Regards Tom
In late August 1944, 4 Tank Troops Workshops REME (later re-numbered 821 Workshop) was under command of 1 Corps and in appendix 7 of August 1944 there is this snippet which might be of interest (WO171/2851): "A very good attempt at record breaking on a Centaur was made by S/Sgt Davies and his squad on a brake job but further trouble, revealed on test, forced us to backload due to unit move – hard luck indeed." Regards Tom
If the five Centaurs that fell out on 22nd August had all done so due to clutch trouble, then it could fairly be said that this demonstrated the mechanical weakness, and consequent unreliability, of the Centaur. But as the brakes and steering on the Centaur were exactly the same as on the Cromwell, problems with these components do not especially reflect badly on the Centaur, and IIRC the steering and brakes were the iffiest components on the Cromwell. From what I can tell, these Centaurs had only been intended to be in action for a few days at most, but instead were in action for almost three months, in improvised units whose resources for repair and maintenance appear to have been far from lavish. So I tend to lean towards the likelihood that the problems that emerged with them towards the end of their service were largely due to inadequate maintenance BUT of course I could be wrong, and there may be more to this issue than immediately meets the eye.
In support of which suggestion, I found this snippet in 1 Corps DDME War Diary (WO171/274): 12 July 1944 [...] OC 33 Armd Bde Wksp has given full co-operation in a scheme to inspect 13 Centaur and 3 Sherman tks left with 6 Airborne Div by the Ryl Marine Sp Gp after the initial phases of this operation. The Royal Marines had little or no knowledge of tk maintenance, and as the tks were being used “dug in” at present CREME 6 Airborne is afraid they will not be able to move when the Division do. OC 33 Armd Bde Wksp has lent one Armt Art (Veh) AFV, 4 Veh Mechs AFV and 2 Fitters to inspect the 16 tks and ensure that they are in running condition. It should be noted that the RM Sp Gp landed on D Day and remained in their special role for the initial period apparently without any fitter help and little or no knowledge of maintenance. The dvrs as far as could be seen on D Day had only just learned how to drive a tk. Regards Tom
