Did the Japanese deserve the Atomic Bomb?

Discussion in 'War Against Japan' started by LostKingdom, Feb 25, 2004.

  1. davidbfpo

    davidbfpo Patron Patron

  2. MarkN

    MarkN Banned

    'Deserve' is a term wholly in the realm of moral. Not military, nor even legal. Was it justified militarily and was it legal are different question to was it 'deserved' morally.

    We all have our own opinions on moral matters, and most of those opinions are so fixed that 'honest' discussion is hard to find.

    As time passes, society changes and thus thinking in society changes. Here, there, and everywhere. What was acceptable yesterday is considered repulsive tomorrow.

    If we quantify or measure 'deserve' by today's moral standards, the answer will probably be different to that of 1945 or 2095. 75 years is a long, long time when it comes to societal change. Which date, and which answer, is thus definitive?
     
    SDP likes this.
  3. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Mark a very well educated and thoughtful piece from yourself.

    My more bull in a china shop approach

    How easy it is for the modern person to state how terrible it all was poor japs etc



    They need to look at the time not now or even in the future
    The japs were an obsessive culture who had already militarily wiped out hundreds of thousands of people.
    Was there a chance of them surrendering.
    By the looks of it no

    Did they deserve it at the time
    yes with knobs on

    Yes I know people like me always make it deserved by showing a photo as per below.
    But these were real people too
    [​IMG]
     
  4. BrianHall1963

    BrianHall1963 Well-Known Member

    My mother lost one brother in Normandy, uncle John was training to invade Japan and my Grandfather on my Dads side would of gone to , would they of came back who knows glad they didn’t.They had no time for the Japanese, John worked in factory that run the Rising Sun next to the Union Jack when a delegation of Japs where coming to visit , he made them take it down or they would have the workforce out on strike the old guys felt so strong about it and get him on aboutHonda at Vickers Supermarine
     
    Dave55 likes this.
  5. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA

    My father was home on leave after returning from Europe and was getting ready to leave for the west coast and then Japan when he heard about the bomb on the radio at my grandmother's house.
     
    von Poop and BrianHall1963 like this.
  6. MarkN

    MarkN Banned

    I consider the defence of the use of the atomic bombs by referencing the treatment of PoWs to be most unhelpful if not, in itself, morally repugnant.

    Old testament eye-for-an-eye retribution was not considered acceptable in British society in 1945 any more then it is now. Tens of thousands of civilians did not 'deserve' to die because troops defeated on the battlefield were mistreated in captivity. The two are quite separate.

    Personally, I believe that the use of the two atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was legitimate politically, militarily, legally and morally.

    The 'retribution' argument only serves to delegitimize the action and provide the naysayers with ammunition to sustain their argument.
     
    Donny Anderson, Blutto and 8RB like this.
  7. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    I think we all agree to disagree and thank you for your very balanced view

    I am sure you knew ex POWS from WW2 along with many of us and some of us go with the stories and lives changed

    I come from a base level it is as simple as that
    It was of the time
     
    BrianHall1963 likes this.
  8. Blutto

    Blutto Banned

    >SNIP<

    Absolutely and without question. The loss of life that would have occurred in a conventional attack was far outweighed by the use of the devices.
     
    Donny Anderson and BrianHall1963 like this.
  9. MarkN

    MarkN Banned

    Your opinion is no less valued than mine or the next poster in line.

    I believe that the two bombs were dropped for the right reason(s). Retribution had no part in the thinking at the time.

    I believe arguing the 'retribution' line only serves to convince others that the bombs were / may have been dropped for the wrong reason and thus gives succor to the naysayers.

    But if you feel tens of thousands of civilians from the general population 'deserved' to die as retribution for untold mistreatment of captives, so be it.

    I hope, for the sake of future generations, that any future enemy of Britain doesn't decide to indescriminately punish the civil general population for the crimes of others.
     
  10. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Mark
    I did not say deserved to die
    I am simply saying of the time it was the right thing to do ending a fanatical regime.Also ending more allied lives lost invading Japan possibly including my father
    As happened all over world at that time many civilians were killed.




    .
     
  11. MarkN

    MarkN Banned

    Clive,

    You do not have to defend yourself. I am not saying you are wrong to have the opinion you do. Nor am I trying to change your mind. The 'retribution' opinion is, as you rightly pointed out, quite commonplace.

    My point was to highlight that 'retribution' is a 'wrong' justification for a 'right' decision. And thus, when used, only serves to aid the otherside of the argument.

    If you do/did not believe that the killing of tens of thousand of the general population by the two bombs had no connection to the mistreatment of PoWs, and that you are against the notion that it was 'deserved' because of that mistreatment, then perhaps it would have been better not to post pictures of suffering PoWs accompanied by your words, "Did they deserve it at the time yes with knobs on. Yes I know people like me always make it deserved by showing a photo as per below."

    It is a very unfortunate and misleading combination of words and images if that is not what you really meant.
     
    4jonboy likes this.
  12. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Thank you Mark
    A well balanced view
    Perhaps i need to engage my very small brain before commenting
     
    BrianHall1963 likes this.
  13. muqingfeng

    muqingfeng Member

    I don't know if the US cares or not I know China and North Korea and South Korea definitely want an atomic bomb to blow up all of Japan
     
  14. muqingfeng

    muqingfeng Member

    我有件事要问你隔壁的邻居。你一直在说美国原子弹发生了什么。你有没有想过你在亚洲、我的祖国中国以及邻国朝鲜、新加坡、马尼拉做了什么?原子弹下没有冤魂的说法是真的。你们日本人屠杀亚洲平民战俘,就像纳粹屠杀犹太人一样。这不是很可怜吗?假装自己是原子弹的受害者,不是很不现实吗?


    See Did the Japanese deserve the Atomic Bomb?
     
  15. 4jonboy

    4jonboy Daughter of a 56 Recce Patron

    Please translate to English
     
    dbf likes this.
  16. muqingfeng

    muqingfeng Member

    ok just sorry
     
  17. muqingfeng

    muqingfeng Member

    I have something to ask your next door neighbor. You keep talking about what happened to the US atomic bomb. Have you ever wondered what you are doing in Asia, my home country China and neighboring North Korea, Singapore, Manila? It is true that there are no souls under the atomic bomb. You Japanese slaughtered Asian civilian prisoners of war just like the Nazis slaughtered the Jews. Isn't that pitiful? Isn't it unrealistic to pretend to be a victim of an atomic bomb?
     

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