Dunkirk: The New Evidence - C4 Sun 2nd July 8PM

Interesting literary connection:
Dunkirk – Air Combat Archive – Wing Leader

 

Benefit of the doubt given, but I have a pet loathing for:

~: THE UNTOLD STORY.
~: THE INSIDE ACCOUNT.
~: THE NEW EVIDENCE.
~: THE REAL STORY.
~: THE TRUE FACTS.

...with the tacit suggestion that you've got your hands on some key and previously neglected discovery that trumps all earlier accounts..

 

Looks interesting.

 

And to be fair, he won't have had anything to do with the title - it's standard TV stuff - "Mystery of..." etc...

 

Looks like the new evidence concerns the role of the raf, as Dunkirk was classed as the raf poorest hour so this program look re readdress this.

 

Only the poorest hour to the BEF on the beaches as they struggled to tell the difference between Friendly and Enemy aircraft in 1940 let alone spot them fighting inland south of Dunkirk. I posted these figures in the 1940 Statistics section of the forum 7 years ago in 2010. The last set of figures covering 26th May to the 4th June 1940 covering all of Op Dynamo make for interesting reading.

The RAF never had a poor day during Dynamo. Dynamo probably wouldn't have succeeded if it wasn't for the RAF.

10/12 May 1940

Patrols - 10

Hours Flown - 167.30

Enemy Aircraft Destroyed/Damaged - 6/3

RAF Casualties - 6

13/19 May 1940

Patrols - 28

Hours Flown - 722.00

Enemy Aircraft Destroyed/Damaged - 45/30

RAF Casualties - 18

20/25 May 1940

Patrols - 74

Hours Flown - 1463.00

Enemy Aircraft Destroyed/Damaged - 93/49

RAF Casualties - 30

26 May to 4 June 1940

Patrols - 101

Hours Flown - 4822.00

Enemy Aircraft Destroyed/Damaged - 258/119

RAF Casualties - 87

*Of the 141 RAF casualties initially reported a number are reported to have returned.

 

I was only copying the blurb from my sky + planner

I believe all 3 services went above and beyond to make dynamo a success

 

Thanks for mentioning this Adam, and your kind words.

We don't decide programme titles, that's a channel thing.

However, there is some genuinely new material in it and one of my small parts in it is discussing some never before seen images taken during Op Dynamo.

 

5000 hours and 258 destroyed enemy planes? That certainly flies against the narrative that the RAF were not present!

 

Paul,

I look forward to seeing the programme.

As many here know I harp on about this: but the part played by the Merchant Navy is consistently overlooked. They saved about 90,000 from Dunkirk; and over 180,000 troops and countless civilians from France in the three weeks after Dynamo, they never get any credit for it. Surely this is a story worth telling?

Roy

 

Looking forward to watching the programme.

 

looks good.
wasnt the reason that the raf were not seen because they were fighting at 15-20,000 ft intercepting enemy aircraft on their way to the beaches?

 

Beware of generalization.

Not all RAF aircraft were operating at that height and distance.

These well known images of Coastal Command aircraft show the diversity of operations undertaken

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/2f/b8/e5/2fb8e577d0c0027099d2d88d4e94af17.jpg

http://spitfiresite.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/operation-dynamo-crown-copyright-hmso.jpg

They used whatever they could - look at the action of P/O Peters in the Anson
RAFCommands

Dogfight with Bf109s at 50 ft and two shot down at the same time - one by Peters with the fwd vickers and one by the gunner in the manual power turret.


Ross

 

I do not think that there has been any doubt in the contribution paid by the RAF in providing air cover to the Dunkirk evacuation beaches.There was certainly a constraint imposed by the numbers of aircraft that the RAF could put up and this did fall short of the ideal continual air cover.This reflects back to the prewar strength of Fighter Command and the aircraft losses in the Battle for France.

The Germans always had the initiative to mount operations at a time of their own choosing.They also had the advantage of having possession of front line recently overrrun airfields while the duration of RAF fighters was something like 1.5 hours meaning a return trip back to English airfields to refuel and rearm.Any suitable aircraft was utilised and there was a claim that a Lysander accounted for an enemy aircraft.

As regards operational statistics.In the 10 days from 26 May to 4 June,the RAF conducted 101 patrols over the Dunkirk area,involving 4822 flying hours and accounting for 262 enemy aircraft destroyed.

The Supplement to the London Gazette of 17 July 1947 gives a very good account of Operation Dynamo but is largely confined to the role of the sea evacuation......The Evacuation of the Allied Armies from Dunkirk and Neighbouring Beaches.

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/UK/LondonGazette/38017.pdf

It was well known that there was some dissent from those on the beaches that there was a lack of presence by the RAF and this has tended to generate the myth.

 

Quite a good documentary, with appropriate supporting evidence I thought.

It wasn't all about "new evidence" that the documentary's title implied but otherwise it was fine.

 

So the new evidence of AIR81 Casualty files points to the entire RAF presence surrounding Dunkirk during the evacuation was one command and almost exclusively one type.

"Beware of generalization."

Ross

 

What a waste of an hour watching that !! Air Battle for Dunkirk - 26 may - 3 june 1940 by Norman Franks - first published in 2000 my edition 2006 - published by Grubstreet. tells the story I didn't hear anything new in that programme ! TED