Fastest Plane Of The War

Discussion in 'The War In The Air' started by Kirkyboy2, Nov 21, 2005.

  1. Kirkyboy2

    Kirkyboy2 Junior Member

    Which plane was the fastest of the Great war...
    can be Allied or Axis.


    Lets hear you????

    dan
     
  2. Gnomey

    Gnomey World Travelling Doctor

    The great war? 1914-1918 or are you refering to '39-'45.

    WW2 - Level Flight - ME163/262 - 593mph (955km/h)/866km/h (538 mph) repectively.

    Dive - Not too sure a lot of planes had high dive speeds such as the P-47, P-51 and the Spitfire.

    WW1 I'm not too sure, I will do some research and get back to you.
     
  3. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    If you are talking about the war of 1914-1918, then off the top of my head I think it would be either the Fokker D-VII or Sopwith Snipe, but don't quote me!
     
  4. jimbotosome

    jimbotosome Discharged

    The P-80 Shooting Star was deployed in the ETO before the end of the war with Germany. It's speed was 558 mph. Only two were deployed before the VE Day and 2800 were ordered for the war in Japan (though canceled after VJ Day). A modified variation of this aircraft set the speed record at 624 mph. Of course it's life was short because of the development of the F-86 Super Saber. It would have been nice to see the reaction on an ME-262 pilots face when he saw one of these coming at him.
     
  5. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    Interesting. Where were the two P-80s actually deployed?

    Minor point, but the Super Sabre was the F-100, not the F-86....
     
  6. jimbotosome

    jimbotosome Discharged

    You are correct Adam, the F86 was a Saber, not a Super Saber.

    The P-80s deployed before the end of the war in Germany were deployed in Italy. If actually went on combat missions but I think they were wanting to "break in" the pilots before introducing it to the ETO. I think they had about 800 built before VJ day when the contract was canceled. These planes were used in the Korean conflict and were very effective against the Mig 15.
     
  7. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    I geuss serious contenders would have to include the remarkable Dornier 335 Arrow, which featured two props in a "push-me-pull-you" arrangement, as in the later Cessna Skyknight used over Vietnam as a FAC. The Arrow could do somewhere in the region of 480mph - pretty fast for a prop job.

    Then there is the twin jet engine Arado 234 Blitz recce machine, which was around the 500mph mark. Indeed, it relied on its straight line speed to avoid interception..

    On the American side, I believe the Grumman Bearcat and Tigercat (US Navy fighters) were way up there too, but I'd have to look up the exact figures.
     
  8. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    Well, it turns out the Bearcat's top speed was 421mph - not as fast as I'd thought.

    On the British side, there was the Hawker Tempest II and, its direct development, the Hawker Sea Fury. Although neither of these saw wartime service, they were designed and flown before war's end, so could I geuss be included. At 460-470 mph, not as fast as some, but still well up there....

    It was the P-80 that claimed the life of Richard Bong, and was the contemporary of the British Hawker Sea Hawk, which was designed about the same time. Both were nice looking aircraft, I thought...

    Of course, we haven't mentioned the De Haviland Vampire, the little twin boom British fighter that could quite happily sit at over 50,000 feet, unassailable, as Gloster Meteors struggled to intercept it in exercises shortly after the war. It first flew in 1943, but didn't enter service before war's end...
     
  9. jimbotosome

    jimbotosome Discharged

    One thing to consider about the ME-262 vs P-80 matchup, the ME-262 was rushed into production before it was ready and had been properly tested. This was for obvious reasons. The P-80 on the other hand was not put into action until it had sufficient testing done to it. However, the two that were sent to Italy were purposed as a morale booster to the USAAF who were concerned that they were seeing more and more jets with nothing to directly oppose them. By the time variants and improvements were added, the 262 would have been quickly outclassed, but development stopped at VJ day so the records were set with war time aircraft with certain modifications.
     
  10. sapper

    sapper WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Just once while in Holland 44 I witnessed a confrontation between a German jet and some allied planes. I recall the jet, it was coloured silver. When the Allied planes drew near it took off like a scalded cat. Leaving them standing.
    I only saw it once, and if my memory is correct it was near the German border at Mook in Holland. At that time we never knew anything about Jets, we did not even know they had been invented.

    At night there, we watched as the German rockets were fired into space.
    Sapper
     
  11. dakota

    dakota Junior Member

    images/smilies/default/cool.gif When the Great War is mentioned I always assume this was the 1914-1918 war.

    In my records the fastest WW1 fighter was the Sopwith Snipe (Bentley BR2 engined) produced late in 1918 only about 100 being in service at the end of WW1. Its speed was 195 mph @ 10,000 ft.
    This was 10mph faster than the Camel and 7 MPH faster than the Sopwith Triplane.

    dakota
     
  12. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    Dakota,

    I think you must be mistaken on the speeds you cite for the Snipe, Triplane and Camel.

    The Snipe was fast for its day, but no WW1 biplane could do 195mph!!! Even in 1931, the fastest RAF fighter then in service - the biplane Hawker Fury - could only do 201 mph. And a triplane configuration produces maximum manouverability at the expense of top speed. I should have thought around 100 mph a more accurate figure for the triplane, and around 120mph for the Snipe, but I stand to be corrected.

    Where did you obtain your figures?

    (sapper @ Nov 22 2005, 08:27 AM) [post=41950]Just once while in Holland 44 I witnessed a confrontation between a German jet and some allied planes. I recall the jet, it was coloured silver. When the Allied planes drew near it took off like a scalded cat. Leaving them standing.
    I only saw it once, and if my memory is correct it was near the German border at Mook in Holland. At that time we never knew anything about Jets, we did not even know they had been invented.

    At night there, we watched as the German rockets were fired into space.
    Sapper
    [/b]

    Sounds like it may have been an as yet unpainted He 162 Salamander, designed to be flown by Hitler Youth pilots.
     
  13. spidge

    spidge RAAF RESEARCHER

    (adamcotton @ Nov 22 2005, 08:10 PM) [post=41958]Dakota,

    I think you must be mistaken on the speeds you cite for the Snipe, Triplane and Camel.

    The Snipe was fast for its day, but no WW1 biplane could do 195mph!!! Even in 1931, the fastest RAF fighter then in service - the biplane Hawker Fury - could only do 201 mph. And a triplane configuration produces maximum manouverability at the expense of top speed. I should have though around 100 mph a more accurate figure for the triplane, and around 120mph for the Snipe, but I stand to be corrected.

    Where did you obtain your figures?[/b]

    Maybe the Spits are getting more pricey every day. Look at the "worth" of this Camel.

    Recent independent appraisals of this Camel show a high appraised value of $2.8 million and a low of $1.6 million

    For Sale : Sopwith Camel : Serial No. B6291, Reg. No. G-ASOP
    http://www.vintageaviation.net

    This is the premier example of the most famous fighter of WW1. There are only 4 other F-1 Camels left in the world today. In addition, there are 3 Navy Type Camels designated 2F-1. All of these are permanently in museums in various stages of originality. Even the Army, Navy, Air Force and Smithsonian museums do not have a "real" Camel! They have only replicas.


    View attachment 1286


    Sopwith F.1 Camel, No. B6291

    Recent independent appraisals of this Camel show a high appraised value of $2.8 million and a low of $1.6 million.

    This is the only well documented original flyable Camel. This is the only remaining one that was built by Sopwith. All others were built by subcontractors at other factories. This is the only complete Camel with documented history placing it in an operational squadron on the western front during WW1 (No. 10 Squadron).

    This Camel was restored to flying status in 1989 by British Aerospace Company in the same factory, Kingston on Thames, where it was originally constructed in 1917. This is the only Camel to have its original data plate. This 84-year old Camel is unmatched in condition and in historical importance by any Camel in the world today. The airframe and the 110 hp LeRhone engine were carefully overhauled and test flown. All work was professionally documented.



    See the online advertisment for further details.
     
  14. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    Well, I can understand a price tag of that enormity on a warbird as rare as a Camel, but Spitfires have only increased in number over the last fifteen years, so you'd have thought the price would've come down, not up.....

    Of course, the initial purchase price is only the start. Running and maintainence costs must be horrendous!!!
     
  15. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    (dakota @ Nov 22 2005, 09:00 AM) [post=41956]images/smilies/default/cool.gif When the Great War is mentioned I always assume this was the 1914-1918 war.

    In my records the fastest WW1 fighter was the Sopwith Snipe (Bentley BR2 engined) produced late in 1918 only about 100 being in service at the end of WW1. Its speed was 195 mph @ 10,000 ft.
    This was 10mph faster than the Camel and 7 MPH faster than the Sopwith Triplane.

    dakota
    [/b]

    Just looked up some specs on the Snipe:

    Country: Great Britain
    Manufacturer: Sopwith Aviation Company
    Type: Fighter
    First Introduced: 1918
    Number Built: 497
    Engine(s): Bentley B.R.2, 230 hp
    Wing Span: 31 ft 1 in
    Wing Area: 271 sq ft
    Length: 19 ft 10 in
    Height: 9 ft 6 in
    Empty Weight: 1312 lb
    Gross Weight: 2020 lb
    Max Speed: 121 mph
    Ceiling: 19,500 ft
    Endurance: 3 hrs

    Similarly, the Sopwith Camel:
    Country: Great Britain
    Manufacturer: Sopwith Aviation Company
    Type: Fighter
    First Entered Service: May 1917
    Number Built: 5,734
    Engine(s): Bentley BR.1, 150 hp
    Reciprocating Le Rhône Rotary x 1, 110 hp
    Clerget 9B, 9 cylinder, air cooled rotary, 130 hp
    Clerget 9Bf, 9 cylinder, air cooled rotary, 140 hp
    Wing Span: 28 ft
    Length: 18 ft 8 in
    Height: 8 ft 6 in
    Empty Weight: 889 lb
    Gross Weight: 1,422 lb
    Max Speed: 118 mph
    Ceiling: 19,000 ft
    Endurance: 2.5 hours
    Crew: 1
    Armament: 2 Vickers .303 machine guns (F.1)
    1 Vickers .303 and 1 Lewis .303 machine guns
    or 2 Lewis .303 machine guns (2F.1)

    And the Triplane would do 117mph @5000 feet.
     
  16. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    According to aerospace.org the official highest speed record (piston powered) is held by a Grumman F8F Bearcat , which set the 528.33 mph record on 21 August 1989. This Bearcat was stripped , tuned, glossed and pampered with modern day equipment to look after it and make sure it went as fast as possible in pursuit of the record. Its not really representative of the type but a unique machine in its own right.

    The Supermarine Spiteful - designed with a laminar flow wing as a Spitfire replacement - was claimed to have a top speed of 485mph but on one test Jeffrey Quill, the renowned Spitfire test pilot, had it up to 494mph on a level run! The Spitfeul (and its naval variant, the Seafang) never went into service, however, as it was eclipsed by the advent of the jet age.

    A P-51 posted an above 500 mph run at the Reno air races 2 years ago, but was similarly tweaked to the Bearcat. In fact, those machines are aeronautical "freaks", but they sure chase the wind along...

    Then there was the twin engined, single-seat DH Hornet (based on the earlier Mosquito) at 485mph (it also had a blistering rate of climb, 4800 fpm) - both the Hornet and the Spiteful being "real" fighters with guns! The highest speed I have seen quoted for a stock Bearcat is 455mph.

    On the afternoon of May 25 1948 a silver aircraft flew over Melbourne at an unprecedented 502mph. This aircraft carried a number of innovative design features, performed very well, and was considered by many people to be the ultimate piston engined fighter. The brainchild of Lawrence Wackett, head of the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation (C.A.C) it was totally Australian in design and manufacture. It was the CA-15. It did, howver, bear some resemblance to the P-51 Mustang.

    Anyway, pics of three of the fastest attached. The De Haviland Hornet, which was put into production and was scheduled to see service against the Japanese in the Pacific; the XP-47J, which didn't go into production; and the Martin-Baker MB5 which, despite being hailed by many as probably the best fighter evolved during WW2, also never made it into production.

    View attachment 1287 View attachment 1288 View attachment 1289
     
  17. adrian roberts

    adrian roberts Senior Member

    Its not clear which war the original question was about, but if he did mean WW1, then the Nieuport-Delage 29 was being tested at the end of the war and had a max speed quoted as 142 mph. The Martinsyde F4 Buzzard, of which the RAF had about 50 at the armistice, but was also not operational and would have been an SE5a replacement, had a max of 132.
    On the other hand the Spad XIII has a max speed quoted as 137, but this aircraft entered service in May 1917 and without confirmation from other sources I would not be sure it was that good.
    Adrian
     
  18. mattgibbs

    mattgibbs Senior Member

    Heinkel He 162. 562mph at altitude. Although made into fighter squadrosn was not operational as a fighter, still being tested and ironed out at the wars end. An occasional allied pilot may have seen one on test, but thats about it, although there was one claimed kill with a 162.
    regards
    MG
     
  19. adrian roberts

    adrian roberts Senior Member

    The He162 was supposed to be a cheap "people's fighter" (Volksjager) but it was lethal to fly and killed several of its own pilots. At least one RAF test pilot was killed in one after the war.

    Adrian
     
  20. adamcotton

    adamcotton Senior Member

    The interesting thing about the He 162 was that it was made entirely of wood (the one material then still in plentiful supply in Germany) and was, quite literally, glued together! It was this fact that made it so lethal to its pilots, as German glue technology at that time lagged behind other nations and, as a consequence, the He 162 had a nasty propensity to come un-glued whilst airborne, particularly in turning flight!

    Its cockpit was also transplanted from the Focke-Wulf FW190, to save time in its design and production. Personally, I wouldn't have fancied flying one...!
     

Share This Page