Book Review Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944: From Dunkirk to D-Day

Discussion in 'Books, Films, TV, Radio' started by Ramiles, Feb 4, 2020.

  1. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944: From Dunkirk to D-Day
    First published in the UK by Routledge 2000. This edition: 20 Jan 2016 - History - 240 pages

    Dr Timothy Harrison Place, Timothy Harrison Place

    Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944

    "In this study, the author traces the reasons for the British Army's tactical weakness in Normany to flaws in its training in Britain. The armour suffered from failures of experience. Disagreements between General Montgomery and the War Office exacerbated matters."

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    Last edited: Feb 4, 2020
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  2. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    I've read the introduction and the first chapter: there are a lot of caveats!

    I shall bring you tea (of a brand of my choosing), on Wednesday afternoons, in June, except during leap-years and on those days when it looks like rain. Biscuits and milk are excluded from this promise, and although it has yet to be ascertained whether you actually like tea or whether any will be available, other people have said that you probably do and it probably will be, so this is what I'm planning.

    It may well be very good, but that title is looking rather grand after all that's been ruled-out.
     
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  3. smdarby

    smdarby Well-Known Member

    Didn't we win the Battle of Normandy?
     
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  4. Charley Fortnum

    Charley Fortnum Dreaming of Red Eagles

    Technically, yes.

    But points deducted for a lack of brio and élan.

    Relying on your strengths is tantamount to cheating.

    The Germans would have done it better. ;)
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2020
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  5. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    I think the book looks to be about 20 years old now, albeit the version: Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944

    May have some changes from 2000, not sure.

    I was glancing at some of the refs. to the 11th Armoured Division in there, i.e. in the 7th Chapter on "Armoured Divisions":

    i.e. Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944

    Also some thoughts / reviews here:
    Amazon.co.uk:Customer reviews: Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944: From Dunkirk to D-Day (Military History and Policy)

    As an aside:

    11th Armoured Division (United Kingdom) - Wikipedia

    For example, has:

    "In November 1942, as the Allies invaded French North Africa as part of Operation Torch the division, then serving in Scotland and now commanded by Major-General Brocas Burrows after Hobart was deemed too old, at 57, for active service, was warned to prepare for overseas service to join the British First Army, soon to be engaged in hard fighting in Tunisia, and began embarking when the order was cancelled, as it was felt that less armour and more infantry were needed in the difficult terrain in that country."

    With a ref. there though to:
    • British Armoured Divisions and Their Commanders, 1939–1945, Richard Doherty
    I'd seen that "it was felt that less armour and more infantry were needed in the difficult terrain in that country" also said, I think, of Normandy.
     
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  6. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    I haven’t read it for a while but remember thinking that the author had done a lot of research. He based some of his analysis, however, on an analysis of war diaries of a partial sample of British units and commented critically on the lack of detailed references to training exercises. He may have just been unlucky with the ones he picked on though, as the war diaries of 59 Inf Div infantry units (I think I’ve looked at 4 out of 9) have quite detailed weekly training programmes as appendices to first few months of 1944. They all end in August 1944, so may just have been less savagely weeded compared to those for units which covered Jan - Dec 44.

    I’d definitely recommend it though, as it certainly contains much of interest.

    regards

    Tom
     
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  7. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    According to ref. (below) came about as an outgrowth of a 1997 University of Leeds doctoral thesis.

    JOURNAL ARTICLE
    Review:
    Reviewed Work: Military Training in the British Army, 1940-1944: From Dunkirk to D-Day by Timothy Harrison Place
    Review by: Colin F. Baxter
    upload_2020-2-5_9-18-34.gif
    The Journal of Military History
    Vol. 66, No. 2 (Apr., 2002), pp. 602-603 (2 pages)

    Details - Title - Tactical doctrine and training in the infantry and armoured arms of the British Home Army, 1940-1944
    Creator - Place, Timothy Harrison, 1964-
    Dissertation
    Thesis (Ph.D.) -- University of Leeds (School of History), 1997.
    Publisher: Leeds
    Creation Date: 1997
    Subject: Great Britain Army Drill and tactics
    Great Britain Army -- History -- World War, 1939-1945
    World War,1939-1945 -- Great Britain
    Format
    287 leaves.
    Source
    Library Catalogue
    Local subjects
    Theses History
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Feb 5, 2020

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