No.11 Military Mission - Unmarked Grave Possibly Identified

Discussion in '1940' started by Drew5233, Aug 18, 2010.

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  1. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Could this be his grave in Esquelbecq Cemetery?

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  2. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    He is buried next to LCpl Webber in the cemetery.

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  3. walmer_10

    walmer_10 Junior Member

    2nd Lieut. Edgcumbe was blown up by an anti tank shell.

    Asher Pirt

    Home
     
  4. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Hi,

    I can't find any mention of Edgcumbe in that link. Any chance you can qoute what is written about him and the original source?
     
  5. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    I wonder if LCpl FLA Rourke is still alive (See post 17), he survived the war. Interestingly his NOK details are within spitting distance of where I was born and lived for half of my life.
     
  6. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    On a side note:

    I've noted Idlers selection of suggested files and will get them in due course. If anyone else has any ideas for possible lines of inquiry and the like post them on here. I think someone sent me some information and now I can't find it so the safest place is on here where I know I can find it.

    Thanks all
    Andy
     
  7. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    From A. Philson's BEF May 1940.

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  8. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Taken from the above named file.
    On the evening of the 27th May light tank patrols of the Hopkinson Mission carried out reconnassiance in the area of Wormhout-Cassel-Zeggers.

    This fits in with the description given in the L/Cpl Webber thread from the French Farmer who found the two bodies (See L/Cpl Webber thread for more details).
     
  9. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Further reading says that:

    Personel for the Phantom Squadron were provided by 12 Lancers, RTR, RAC and QVR.

    Light Tanks are Guy wheeled 'Light Tanks' (Armoured Cars).

    On the 27th May light tank patrols were sent to assist the 144th Bde west of Wormhout (This could be near Esquelbecq near where the two men were found and are now buried).
     
  10. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    From the same file it states that the Mission only lost one officer. 2nd Lt. P R Edgecumb is listed on the nominal roll posted earlier in this thread.

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    I can't seem to find any other Officers listed on the nominal roll as killed in 1940 let alone on the same day as the headstone apart from Edgcumbe (name spelled differently on CWGC).
     
  11. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    The trouble is Andy, we don't know for sure to which unit the unknown officer belonged, or even his rank. Bearing in mind the disorganisation at the time, it could be co-incidence that these two graves are next to each other.

    Interesting by the way to see a reference to the Guy 'Wheeled Tanks'. They even had 'T' prefix census numbers.

    WarWheels.Net - Guy Mark I/IA/Prototype Wheeled Tank Photos.

    Based on the Guy Quad tractor, they probably weren't the most spritely of vehicles with all that armour.
     
  12. idler

    idler GeneralList

    Surely CWGC hold records of the original burials that may associate the unknown officer with Webber to put things beyond reasonable doubt?

    I see the CWGC now have catalogues for their archives, maybe that's the next move?
     
  13. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

  14. Buteman

    Buteman 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA

    Noticed he came from Chelsfield, kent and found his name commemorated on the Orpington War Memorial.

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    He is buried next to LCpl Webber in the cemetery.

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    CL1 and Drew5233 like this.
  15. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Just got off the phone with CWGC.

    They won't disclose any information over the phone (Which I understand for WW2 cases) and have asked that I send in a covering letter and hard copies of everything I have regarding this matter.

    Seems promising?

    Please feel free to add any further lines of enquiry that I could follow up - I'm not bothered about costs, time and effort etc. I'm just running short of ideas and I am 99% certain it is him.
     
  16. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    9th/12th Lancers Museum only have basic information and were not aware of Hopkinson Mission until today.

    I'm sending them all I have on 12th Lancers for their records.
     
  17. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    I want to make contact with the librarian (a local historian) at Esquelbecq Public Library in France. The Library is in Place de Bergerot.

    Anyone got any ideas apart from driving there?


    EDIT:

    I found this one: mediatheque.esquelbecq (at) wanadoo.fr If you come up with any others feel free to post or PM it to me.
     
  18. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Sadly all lines of inquiry have come to an end. I'll be placing a cross on each grave when I'm next in France.

    Thanks for all your imput - The unknown grave will always be 2nd Lt. Edgcumbe to me. :poppy:
     
  19. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    I have made contact with Guy Rommelaere and he sent me a map showing me where the farm was, annoyingly it was knocked down around a year ago to make way for a redevelopment of the D17.

    The farm was located where the D17 sign is on the map between Zegerscappel and Esquelbecq. Now a roundabout.

    [​IMG]

    I've asked Guy if there might be any clues to the officers ID in French records.

    Cheers
     
  20. idler

    idler GeneralList

    Bit bored this afternoon so this is Andy's junction in 1957, courtesy of IGN:

    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=61279&stc=1&d=1315663826

    The house is not inconsistent with the one in Andrew's photo of a Guy wheeled tank in this thread:

    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/1940/45936d1298039070-bef-vehicles-2005-05-18-026-destroyed-france-cropped-jpg

    I note that the file name implies that the photo has been cropped, I wonder if there's a clearer view of the staggered junction in the original?

    Even better, though, the IGN map (pre-roundabout) names the junction:

    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=61281&stc=1&d=1315664228

    Could the name on the house/pub be LE REPOS DES CHASSEURS?

    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=61282&stc=1&d=1315664451

    My eye of faith sees ..REPO..

    :poppy::poppy:
     

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