Short Stirling

Discussion in 'The War In The Air' started by Gerard, Apr 1, 2009.

  1. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Mike,

    Nor could I find an example of a Short Stirling or any craft for that matter pulling 2 Horsas. It must have been an impressive sight if it was ever done. According to this site the Short Stirling had the capacity:

    They proved efficient in this new role, towing one General Aircraft Hamilcar or two Airspeed Horsas for assault and up to five General Aircraft Hotspurs on a ferry flight or for training.

    You can see American Dakotas setting off for Operation Varsity towing two Wacos each on YouTube. From what I can gather the ropes would be different lengths. Still they appear perilously close on take off.

    Rhine Airborne Operations in WWII - YouTube
     
  2. Harry Ree

    Harry Ree Very Senior Member

    I recall reading that the designers of the Sterling wanted to extend the wingspan beyond 99 feet however the Air Ministry refused to allow this in order to allow the aircraft to fit into existing hangers which had doors 100 feet wide. " the appalling prospect of having to enlarge a few hangers or to build some new ones, was one the Air Ministry could not face, particularly when the easier solution was available of simply ruining the altitude performance of the RAF's first four engined bomber."

    In the end,the size of the aircraft did not matter.Early experience of the war showed that aircraft in hangers were more vunerable to the effects of airfield bombing.

    Hence aircraft were parked as remote as possible from the technical areas and as runways were laid down on prewar permanent airfields, extra dispersals were constructed with the intention of making aircraft less of an easy target from the air.As new airfields were laid down from greenfield sites to Class A Bomber standard,the 36 dispersal airfield with T2 Hangers dispersed,became the template for Bomber Command expansion.1st Line Servicing was carried out on the dispersals with hangers used for Second Line Servicing (minor or major) but this was frequently not possble.


    Two squadrons based on a permanent airfield could have up to 2 x 30 aircraft on charge, at the maximum, or 2 x 18 aircraft as the minmum.Not much chance of hanger accomodation on a permanent station with the 4 traditional C Type Hangers so even the more intensive servicing was carried out in the open although each squadron would have been allocated one hanger which would also accomodate the administration offices and crewrooms of the squadron.Even so such was the manpower levels on a squadron that Nissen huts provided extra crewroom and operational office accomodation.
     
    Dave55 likes this.
  3. Mike L

    Mike L Very Senior Member

    Cee, some great footage on that link, thanks.
    From what I can make out from the Dakota/Waco pair the port glider was on a slightly shorter tow and, as it appears there is a common tow hitch position, the glider pilots would have to pull to port or starboard as appropriate for the whole flight to keep separated. Probably a lot easier in a Waco than a Horsa.
     
  4. Orwell1984

    Orwell1984 Senior Member

    Here's some images I've found of double tow arrangements for gliders. Included is a shot of the pickup arrangements. The only operational references I could find have C-46's, C-47's, C-54's and in one case a B-17 as tow aircraft. Nothing for a Stirling. This setup seems to have been used in Operation Varsity and in the CBI for some of the later Chindit operations.
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Gerard

    Gerard Seelow/Prora

    That looks like a really risky operation, trying to tow 2 gliders. Imagine trying to tow them during inclement weather. Imagine being a glider pilot in one of them............
     
  6. Mike L

    Mike L Very Senior Member

    Good pics Orwell, seem to show the same arrangement as Cee's YouTube video.
    As you say Gerard, Glider Pilot's nightmare.
     
  7. Bazooka Joe

    Bazooka Joe Member

  8. F for Freddie

    F for Freddie Junior Member

    I here on the rumour grapevine. Corgi Diecast models may next summer 2014 release a Diecast Short Stirling bomber in DD strips Ltd Edition in 1/72 towing a Horsa glider! To commemorate 70 years D-Day invasion!!
     
  9. Za Rodinu

    Za Rodinu Hot air manufacturer

  10. Orwell1984

    Orwell1984 Senior Member

    [​IMG]
    One of my favourite Stirling pictures. Very iconic.
     
  11. Za Rodinu

    Za Rodinu Hot air manufacturer

    "Shit, missed my flight and the bar is closed until tomorrow!"
    :p
     
  12. Fred Wilson

    Fred Wilson Member

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1TyFCRLqEM
     
  13. Fred Wilson

    Fred Wilson Member

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqIwErpB2zY
     
    john evans and CL1 like this.
  14. bamboo43

    bamboo43 Very Senior Member

  15. Pat Atkins

    Pat Atkins Well-Known Member

    Thanks for posting that link, Bamboo43.

    It's of interest to me, as my uncle trained as a Stirling pilot and in fact flew one operation as such in a Special Duties role (624 Sqdn out of Blida, Algeria, to S. of France on the night of 30/31 August 1944). He was then transferred to 148 Sqdn and flew 35 operations on Halifaxes in the same role. The success of the Stirling's cloak-and-dagger role seems to reflect its high load capacity for stores and personnel to be dropped, and its apparently excellent handling characteristics in the air. Anyway, you'd hope they'll get an aircraft ID from the North Sea site as there may well have been casualties.

    Cheers, Pat.

    PS: as an aside, it's amazing how contemporary opinions of the aircraft type seem to be pretty polarised for or against: 148 had a definite dislike of the Stirling, but why I don't know - parochialism, maybe. I've posted this elsewhere on the Forum, so apologies if you've seen it, but I enjoy the snippy irony of this comment in the otherwise humour-free ORB so much I'll post it again:

    Brindisi 13/12/44 One Stirling aircraft LK176 left the squadron for Maison Blanche. No tears were shed over its departure for its loss is a gain to the squadron.
     
  16. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

  17. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    It shoulldn't be too difficult as the undercarriage was huge :)

    Regards
    Tom
     
  18. MJHS

    MJHS New Member

    Is anyone able to give some advice on the landing approach profile for RAF ‘heavies’, i.e. curved or straight in and the appropriate heights and distances? I had a long gone relative who was a Stirling pilot on 90 Sqdn in the first 6 months of 1943 before going on to be an instructor at 1651 HCU. I fly light a/c and have been thinking recently about trying to fly to as many of the UK airfields in his log book as possible (only 7 of the listed 43 are still active). For the ones that have closed I’d like to fly mock approaches as closely as possible to the way things were done at the time.

    Thanks in hope.
     

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