Sunderland / Flyingboat photos.

Discussion in 'The War In The Air' started by James S, Mar 8, 2009.

  1. Wimpy

    Wimpy Member

    Found this interesting picture in my childhood scrapbook of everything aeronautical!!

    Thought you might like to see it in this thread.

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    (;)if you squint a lot you can just make out a Ju88 with a Bf109 on top!!!:huh:)
     
  2. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    Wimpy,

    A very early Mystel combination!!

    Regards
    Tom
     
  3. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    If memory serves me right Don Bennet of Pathfinder fame had something to do with this odd combination aircraft.
    See what you mean Whimpy - the JU88 like tail not sure about the 109 crazy looking outfit.
     
  4. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    Looked this out for Juan this Am , something which I had been searching for amongest others.

    I think , not 100% sure but it may be that this was developed the wrong way round - it just does not "look right to me".
    ( I am almost sure I have sen this photo - "the oter way round".)

    There is a tint of illusion in this one , look at it and you can see it as either flying towards you or away from you.
    A 202 Squaron catalina over the med. before they moved up to Lough Erne.

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  5. ramacal

    ramacal 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA Patron

  6. ramacal

    ramacal 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA Patron

    Just found something and a bit of video footage from the "Wreck Detectives"

    Pembroke Dock Sunderland Trust - 01646 623 425

    (I remember it because of the lovely Miranda Krestovnikoff, one of the presenters).

    And of course, during WW2, Pembroke Dock was the largest Sunderland Flying boat base in the World.
     
  7. ramacal

    ramacal 336/102 LAA Regiment (7 Lincolns), RA Patron

  8. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    An engine was raised, John Evans who was consulted on it is one of the best read men you will find on things Sunderland related.
     
  9. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    Looked this out for Juan this Am , something which I had been searching for amongest others.

    I think , not 100% sure but it may be that this was developed the wrong way round - it just does not "look right to me".
    ( I am almost sure I have sen this photo - "the oter way round".)

    There is a tint of illusion in this one , look at it and you can see it as either flying towards you or away from you.
    A 202 Squaron catalina over the med. before they moved up to Lough Erne.

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    That is a wonderful photo and as you say the optical illusion effect is fascinating.

    Regards
    Tom
     
  10. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    One gent who flew these on ops ovber the Indian Ocean told me that they used to close one engine down and just amble along on one just above stalling speed endurance wise they could stay up for almost a day.
     
  11. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    Linking to this thread.
    http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/war-air/13019-sunderland-flying-boats-windermere.html#post187333

    See Derek Martins page - the photo of the 201 Squadron aircrew NCO's ( some officers also in photo) at the open nose section of the Sunderland , some of the same group can be found here.

    This as far as I am aware was taken at the Charter House outside Kesh , taken over as temp. accomadation for aircrew / officers until accomadation could be built on site.
    (By all accounts it was "Spartan" at best , I am inclined to think it is at CA.)


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    A fine study of an airman in flying kit- Sgt Raymond Hartshorn atop a Sunderland taken in early 1942 , the hills and shoreline in the background can only be C.A. .
    Below his skipper Sandy Powell.

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    When you look at the exhaust stack you see "Short" - common with the Sterling , the wing - also very similar.




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    Ray and some 201 men on their aircraft circa early 1942 , these men are probably from Sandy Powell's crew.

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    Another 201 crew , not sure who these gents are but they turn up in the group photo above and in the phot posted by Derek Martin.
     
  12. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

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    201 Squadron aircrew, the size of the aircraft on dry land is illustrated by the height of the door.

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    A Catalina crew under training at 131(C) O.T.U. Killadeas, the Sunderland in the background would date this to about mid 1944.
    A good study of the relaxed nature of the crew , love the "Mae Wests" , this must have been the only dry day that year !
     
  13. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    This account is from one of the crew of NJ186 which tore the bottom of her hull out on the Mournes , and surveved severely damaged but in deep trouble.
    The pilot saw the Isle of Man in the disrtance and made for it as he could not land on water , could not ditch his charges and was having great difficulty controlling the aircraft.
    His approach to Jurby field was a one shot approach to getting down and he did well to do so.......frantic efforst to get the crew out and clear were more urgent by the fire which had started , to cap it all her charges blew - and they did so with style taking out very pane of glass for miles around and making an absolute mess of RAF Jurby , to say it was wrecked is not too far from the truth.

    423's CO was order to go to Jurby to make peace and to "calm things down" - when he got there he found he knew the Station Co and after an apology was made and sympathy was extened peace was restored.

    The crew were extremely lucky others who hit peakswere less so .
    423 lost a Sunderland to Knocklayd near bally castle in December 43 with heavy loss of life , 201 lost one to Mount Brandon in August 43 with only 3 of the crew coming out alive and 228 lost one to the Bluestacks in Donegal in January 1944.

    Mountains and flyingboats don't mix , as the crew in the photo will coinfirm !

    It is best not to enlarge these to the maxium , done some time ago on what was then a "good" printer , today it would be considered crap!
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Smudger Jnr

    Smudger Jnr Our Man in Berlin

    James,
    This thread is seriously good reading and viewing.

    Regards
    Tom
     
  15. Gerard

    Gerard Seelow/Prora

    James, that accident on Mt Brandon - Thats Co. Kerry isnt it? Were they off course or was it normal for Coastal Command aircraft to fly nearby???
     
  16. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    I think they must have been a bit of , they would probably have wanted it as a land fall / navigation mark , Brandon has the knack of disappearing into cloud , but it should have appeared on the "S.E." ( Special Equipment ).
    The mountain claimed several aircraft a Sandringham ( Civilain Sunderland airliner) , a Polish Squadron Wellington, a FW-200 , a 202 Catalina also from Castle Archdale crashed close by at Castlegregory. in late 44.
    A radar operator from 423 who was flying down behind her saw her "just disappear from the screen".
     
  17. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    I have the ORB pages for these incidents , somewhere "safe" which means I will have to dig deep for them.
    These accounts come from some who where on board , the chance encounter which could have ended badly, the 2 Ju-88's very lucky........
    Although much is said about the Sunderland being like a porcupine I do think like all large aircraft they were vunerable to the cannon armed heavy fighters.

    F/lt.Dolphin was later to be killed in a night flying exercise on Lough Erne, the Sunderland he was killed on remains in the Lough , a war grave just in the shadow of Magho.
    As a result of the accident aircraft returning were diverted and the flare path had to be closed.
    A memorial stone can be found in the car park overlooking Lough Navar view point - it records the names and the date of the accident.
    It paints a dramatic picture in the mind a wingtip touching water as they banked to go around and the aircraft crashing into the Lough ...terrible.



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    Sgt Gaunts relates to the 26/8/43 encounter ,Sgt Hall , to the 21/8/43
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  18. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    Below is a description of a typical operation as given by a war correspondent. (John Kannawin).

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    The one below was written by a member of aircrew , Graham Buckley of 422 RCAF.
     
  19. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    This came to me back in the late 80's , for me it answered a lot of questions and provided some insights into what these men did and what they saw - this is very much a first hand account by one who "did it".

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  20. Gerard

    Gerard Seelow/Prora

    I think they must have been a bit of , they would probably have wanted it as a land fall / navigation mark , Brandon has the knack of disappearing into cloud , but it should have appeared on the "S.E." ( Special Equipment ).
    The mountain claimed several aircraft a Sandringham ( Civilain Sunderland airliner) , a Polish Squadron Wellington, a FW-200 , a 202 Catalina also from Castle Archdale crashed close by at Castlegregory. in late 44.
    A radar operator from 423 who was flying down behind her saw her "just disappear from the screen".
    From what you are saying it seems as if it was a dangerous place to be flying around. I've visited the area around Mt Brandon, have you been down? Its fairly rugged as places go. Thanks, as ever, for that info James and I'm with smudger on his opinions about your posts :)
     

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