The Delay of the Me262

According to Martin Middlebrook in his book, 'The Schweinfurt-Regensburg Mission - American Raids on 17 August 1943.'
When the Americans bombed Regensburg they also destroyed jigs that craftsmens were preparing for the fuselage of the projected jet fighter, the Messerschmitt 262. The development of the jet was delayed.

Does anybody know how long the delay of the Me262 was?

Many thanks, Gage.

 

Hmm.. According to internet until April 1944 , just googled it, not trying to make an expert report

 

This is from "The Messerschmitt Combat Diary ME-262" by John Forman and S.E. Harvey. ( Air Research Publications) 1990.







In between Galland test flying it (April 43 ) and the production of the fighter some modifications were made , the nose wheel and its place with the structure had to be designed and developed along with its weapons systems.

All going well until Adolf again stuck his nose in.

A great airframe with a poor engine design which was never really up to the demands of combat .

 

I've just skimmed 10 sites for info and most of the delays seem to be along the lines of blaming Hitler 'Mainly because he couldn't make up his mind what he wanted to prioritize in the way of production and he showed little faith in the project early on'.

However I did find this related to the mechaical side of things on this site:
HowStuffWorks "Messerschmitt Me 262"


The Messerschmitt Me 262 was delayed because the Junkers Jumo 004 jet engine that powered it did not reach quantity production until the spring of 1944.


Cheers
Andy

 

Thanks DB and James. But no mention of the USAAF raid of 1943. Maybe it wasn't a big delay. Also ta, Andy.

Another firm was hit in Schweinfurt on the same day and this stopped production for eight days. This firm of Fichtel and Sachs were making fuel pumps for the Me 262.

 

Yes , no mention of the raid of August 43.
This book was later republished and revised , but at the toime of publication Middlebrroks Schweinfurt- Regensburg book was well established and out there to be looked at.

 

I didn't read all of this but thought it may be of some interest Gage.
Schweinfurt–Regensburg mission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In Regensburg all six main workshops of the Messerschmitt factory were destroyed or severely damaged

Cheers
Andy

 

I didn't read all of this but thought it may be of some interest Gage.
Schweinfurt–Regensburg mission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Cheers
Andy

The first raid on Regensburg was far better than the one on Schweinfurt, Andy.
The USAAF lost 60 B-17s on this one day, mate.
47 and half to single-engined fighters
2 and half to twin-engined fighters.
9 to Flak
1 to Mech defect.

 

I remember seeing some B/W candid film of B-17's being shot down one after another on a doc sometime ago...I think it was 'The World at War'. Not a job I envy them doing thats for sure.

 

"Decision Over Schweinfurt" is also a good read , a raid which depended on careful timingto catch the Fighters on the ground -unfortunately the plan went wrong and it presented factros almost entirely in favour of the defenders.
Caught beyond the range of escorting fighters you have to feel for the bomber crews when the fighters fell on them - wolves amongest sheep.

 

Craig,

I think that there were quite a few reasons for the ME 262 entering service later than expected.

Yes the Allied airforces bombed aircraft factories, but about 1943 they were dispersed to avoid any one plant stopping production if it was bombed out.

There were many technical problems experienced from the start and the change from tail dragger to Tricycle undercarriage was made because it was difficult to get the tail dragger off the runway unlesss the brakes were touched to lift the tail.

The front undercarriage always was a week point and lots of accidents happened due to collapsing front undercarriage legs.

The engines were never really refined enough to provide a very reliable power unit.
But this was more down to Bombing and the materials blockade, which forced all manufacturers to use inferior metals or employ new radical unproven technologies, such as hollow turbine blades.

There is only one recorded photograph of an ME 262 with BMW jet power units which was supposed to be more powerful than the Junkers Jumo jet.
Both companies had to contend with cutting edge technologies without the aid of the materials that they wanted to build them with.
So it does not come as a surprise that there were technological delays.

When Hitler first saw the ME 262 fly, He turned to Willy Messerschmitt and asked him if the plane can carry bombs.

Messerschmitt replied that it could, even though it was never designed to carry bombs.
This was a huge mistake as it took extra time to design, plan and build the bomber variant and Hitler insisted that the plane be a Fast Bomber!

There is no doubt that the plane was well ahead of its time, but it is just as well that it was not developed as it could have been.

Regards
Tom

 

Hitler turned a race horse into a carthorse , the advantage of speed was lost and carrying bombs she was no better than a piston engined aircraft.

As Tom says it was more than just putting bomb rcaks on , it changed the aircraft.
The engines required gentle mandling and speed could not be "turned on quickly" - landing and take off very vunerable as Allied fighters exploited.
The engines need replacement after about 20 hours of use.
A further disadvantage was that there was nevera dual trainer- the pilot new to her had a man on the wing to explain all as he taxied round the apron , for less experienced she was a handful.
Another problem was the speed aspect targeting had not fdully kept up with the neew aircraft.

 

Thanks Tom and James.
I had read somewhere about jets being hit while taking off and landing. The Me 262 does look special thou.

 

There has been a small number built in recent years , with modern engines faithful to the wartime design.

YouTube - Me 262 Flys Again!

YouTube - Me 262 the ORIGINAL !!!

YouTube - Messerschmitt Me 262 auf der ILA 2006

 

There has been a small number built in recent years , with modern engines faithful to the wartime design.

YouTube - Me 262 Flys Again!

YouTube - Me 262 the ORIGINAL !!!

YouTube - Messerschmitt Me 262 auf der ILA 2006

Thanks James.
I wonder the difference if the 262 was a year earlier in coming on line.

 

Craig,

You are right about the Allied fighters targeting take off and landings of the ME 262 airfields.

This however was a very risky business as the take off and landing flightpaths were lines with high quality flak and took a toll on Allied fighters that strayed too close.

There are several instances of the jets being shot down on take off and landing.
The ace Nowotney was shot down in these conditions about a kilometer short of the airfield he was landing.

I believe that Adolf Galland witnessed the crash and rushed with others to the scene.

Regards

Tom

 

According to Martin Middlebrook in his book, 'The Schweinfurt-Regensburg Mission - American Raids on 17 August 1943.'
When the Americans bombed Regensburg they also destroyed jigs that craftsmens were preparing for the fuselage of the projected jet fighter, the Messerschmitt 262. The development of the jet was delayed.

Does anybody know how long the delay of the Me262 was?

Many thanks, Gage.

Aviation history records that had not been for the German leadership vacillation on the part of its leadership in the ME 262 development,this aircraft could have regained the ascendancy that the Luftwaffe enjoyed in the early stages of the war.In the end about 15% of nearly 1500 of the aircraft produced were employed operationally and many of these were on close support roles for which the aircraft was not suited.

The production programme was designed with a keydate delivery from May 1944, of 60 machines per month, then mass production as the tooling,raw materials and labour were drawn together.The Regensburg raid,severely damaged the aircraft assembly facilities there and interferred with the delivery of the project. This together with the transfer of the development, from Augsburg to Oberammergau, added to the problems of meeting keydates of production.

There were a number of production models planned,all in the fighter role,the initial production was to be for the (Schwalbe Swallow) ME 262-1a to be an interceptor and the ME 262-1b which would follow it would have been a formidable fighter armed with 24 x 5 cm air to air rockets.However, Hitler's preoccupation with his revenge weapons soon manifested itself and he insisted that all existing fighters must be converted to bombers which caused a delay of 4 months in the tactical employment of the aircraft.This in turn, delayed the pilot conversion training at Lechfield until November 1944 and the training itself was further delayed by the lack of suitable"avtur" fuel which restricted the pilot training hours on the type.A reversal of policy saw the call for a night fighter version in late 1944 and resulted in single sear trainers ME 262B -1a being hurried converted for interceptor use.

At Lechfeld,the Erprobungskommando 262 development unit engaged in the operational perfection of the type.One fact emerged from development testing was the impact on training. It was initially thought that jet aircraft conversion required no specialist training for pilots and until it was resolved by the introduction of a two seat tandem version, ME 262B-1a, there was an unacceptable high accident frequency in conversion.

A total of 1433 aircraft were produced and a further 497 aircraft were destroyed by Allied raids before completion.The Allies received their first intact ME 262 aircraft early in 1945 when a pilot belonging the development unit at Lechfeld, absconded with his aircraft to behind Allied lines as soon as he was aware that his family had been overrun by the Allied advance.His interrogation revealed an availability problem with the Jumo 004s which was to be a major concern in all jet engine design and technology.All the problems had been resolved with the engine such as premature blade failure but the service life of the engine was lifed out after 15 hours operational running.Until higher temperature materials were available to the Germans,engine changes would be required every 15 operational hours.Not a good prospect for the Luftwaffe, which as it was, could never command its home skies in the last year of the war.

 

Hey Tom and James. Is there any books you would recommend to read about combat with the 262?

 

Craig,

I can recommend "Me262 Stormbird Rising" by Hugh Morgan.
Foreword is written by Adolf Galland.

The book is top quality, it was not cheap when I bought it at RAF Cosford Museum several years ago.

There are several full colour plates of the planes flown by the aces, plus information on the units using ther Me 262.
Brief Biographies of the top pilots who flew the Me 262 are very interesting to read.
216 pages including index and packed with information.

Also accounts from Allied pilots who engaged with the Jets.

My Me 262 reference book!

Regards
Tom

 

Craig , this would be the only book I have specifically about the 262 .
It is a good read and deals with the combat see by the jet in diary form from month to month mixed with accounts from both sides.