The number '2' was used for three camps - please see attached chart. Glen Mill - to 1943 when the US took it over as a transit camp Woodhouselee - briefly in 1944 / 45 (Possibly '43 - I don't know when this camp opened / closed). Toft Hall - 1945 onwards. As Camp numbers were unique at any one time - it suggests that Toft Hall - had a different number in 1942 / 43, before the site was taken over by Patton's 'Lucky Rear' (see Osborne2 posts).
Hi Malcolm, I have not got to the bottom of the changes at Toft Hall myself.I will check back later on the local witness account of what went on over the building but I remember he wrote later on that his first account was not in chronological order. However what is clear from the Cheshire Sub Area records in TNA WO 166/14480 Chester Sub-District, that Toft camp re-opened 23 October 1944, after the US pulled out, as Camp 190, the same day as Dunham 189, Marbury 180 (enlisted men), Knutsford POW hospital 24 and Crewe Hall 192 (officers). All, as far as I can tell all, bar Knutsford, were for 'Fanatics' later called C 'Black' to quote the contemporary description. Toft Hall was soon renumbered 2. I believe there are plenty of lists in the TNA files of Italian camps 1942-1944 but no lists have been put up on line that I know of. I have seen them myself but didn't particularly set out to photograph them. I will try to find the photos I have got but they were done in 2015 IIRC. this might take a bit of time as I can't remember the TNA file number. It might be listed in there somewhere. A wild guess, ahead of any further work by me. Perhaps Toft regained it's pre - US occupation camp number of 190 after the Americans left.
The Italian POW camp lists I found were in TNA LAB 8/126. I looked at pages covering late 1941-1944. These are in a massive file but the story of most camps creation and expansion with hostels is told there through the lists. There is also a useful sub-text of why expansion occurred showing the demands of other industries besides agriculture. I haven't posted my photos because they are of such poor quality that even I can't read many of them. I did not go back to redo as I couldn't see during photography, what I was actually looking for. I do know that there are hostels listed that do not appear in any other publication I have read. They came and went as the need arose. Back to your question My clear photos show no camp under the name of Knutsford (nearest town) or Toft Hall. My local account is from a farm literally a stone's throw from Toft Hall. It is clear that initially they had up to 10 prisoners billeted in from Tarporley 74, and that the building of Toft Hall followed later. I can't see why they would have been billeted from Toft, if it was only a minute's walk away.The account is not completely clear but I have now found this quote: 'I am not sure if the Italian Prisoners ever came to the Toft Camp.If they did it was only for a few months before it was taken over by Patton.' Source: Down the Cobbled Stones, J.Lea (Churnet Valley Books 1998), 163. I own up to a red herring. It can't have been numbered Camp 190, pre Patton as 190 appears for the first time in the autumn of 1944 in the block of newly released camp numbers dealing with the prisoner influx post August 1. My final take, currently, is that it was built as a POW camp pre 1944 but not brought into use as it was already designated on the Bolero accommodation list for the US Third Army. Its a guess. I have not proved the hypothesis from UK records or so far not in Fold3 WW2 documents either. Both are very sparse in detail on US Third Army. Good luck Malcolm.
Thank you Osborne2 There is a modern day list for Italian camps - so far when i have referred back from it, it seems pretty accurate. It is too large to upload here. It is by Isabella Insolvibile who has written a great deal about Italian pows - free download - Anno XXXIV, nuova serie, n. 1, giugno 2014
Isabella kindly shared the list with me a few years ago. From Isabella's list, by the look of it, pre -1944 Toft was not a POW camp. That backs up the doubt in John Lea's book that I quoted. I should have remembered I had her paper.Perhaps Patton's men did not have to live there behind barbed wire.
For information the Toff Hall PoW Camp was located in what is now a woodland to the left of the drive way to Toft Hall PoW Camp 2 Toft Hall
