Where did Adolf Hitler die?

Discussion in 'The Third Reich' started by James2019, May 15, 2020.

  1. James2019

    James2019 Member

    hi,

    history tells us that Adolf Hitler commited suicide along with his newly wedded wife eva braun on 30 April 1945 in the fuhrerbunker. But there is a "conspricay" in which bacically says that 2 body doubles of the fuherer and eva go into the fuhrerbunker and they killed theselves, whilst the real Adolf Hitler and Eva Braun fled to argentina. My "source" for this "conspriacy" is a program i watched a while ( i cannot remember the name of the program).

    My question is this: Did Hitler really flee to Argentina? or did he commit suicide?

    Sidenote:- If Hitler did commit suicide, why did thew USSR take his remains and "claim" that the skull they had was that of Hitlers? please bear in mind that years later, scienetists ran tests on the skull and the results of that test where that of a women in her 40s

    thanks
     
  2. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    I'm going to strongly recommend Luke Daly-Groves on Twitter.
    Luke Daly-Groves (@lukedalygroves) | Twitter
    He's written a very well-received book (Not read it, but on my to-do list) & has made a hobby of academically refuting the assorted theories around Adolf & Eva's bunker suicide.
    The programme is most likely 'Hunting Hitler'. He's not a fan.

    31ddteabLTL.jpg
     
    Lindele, PsyWar.Org, James S and 2 others like this.
  3. James2019

    James2019 Member

    ok thanks
     
  4. ltdan

    ltdan Nietenzähler

  5. smdarby

    smdarby Well-Known Member

    Or read Trevor-Roper's "The Last Days of Hitler." He was a British intelligence officer who interviewed witnesses and studied primary documents about Hitler's death in the period just after it happened. As Eisenhower said about the death camps “Get it all on record now - get the films - get the witnesses - because somewhere down the road of history some bastard will get up and say that this never happened.” No serious historian of Nazi Germany (Kershaw et al) has ever found a reason to dispute Trevor-Roper's findings. So, I suppose it comes down to this - believe people who have studied this subject all their lives and whose aim is to further understanding and knowledge, or believe a sensationalist TV programme which has the sole purpose of getting as many people to watch as possible. The former might be more boring, but quite often the truth is boring.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
  6. Robert-w

    Robert-w Well-Known Member

    In any case, as Monty Python has proved on film, he went to a seaside boarding house in Minehead. along with Himmler and von Ribbentrop. Their old friend Mussolini ran the nearby Axis Cafe. :whistle:
     
    alberk and James S like this.
  7. Harry Ree

    Harry Ree Very Senior Member

    A most revealing a account and recognised as official of what occurred in the Chancellery bunker and the comings and goings on which marked the end of the Third Reich.Years later there was a controversy that Bormann had escaped from Germany.Trevor Roper was able to account through the witness of Axmann being with Bormann and others leaving the bunker in the escape of 1 May. Axmann went further and declared he had seen both Bormann and Stumpfegger (Hitler's latest doctor) laid out dead,victims of the Soviet onslaught to take Berlin.
     
    James S, Dave55, AB64 and 1 other person like this.
  8. James2019

    James2019 Member

  9. tmac

    tmac Senior Member Patron

    A book called The Berlin Bunker, by James P O'Donnell, is worth a look. Incidentally, this is the site of the bunker in Berlin, taken on a visit there a few years ago.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: May 17, 2020
    James S and Owen like this.
  10. James2019

    James2019 Member

  11. James S

    James S Very Senior Member

    Von Poop mentioned a very good book, written with these conspiracy theories in mind, best known of them is "Project Grey Wolf" which was the basis ( largely) for the "Hunting Hitler" series, Why James Holland took up with it I will never know ( other than he was paid to take part), the whole thing was something of a well presented shambles. ( I loved the way their " experts" instantly declared things to be bunkers, command posts and observation towers, or said they might be or "this is where I would place a guard post", instantly they were beyond question " the bunker", "the command post" or "the defensive wall" etc).
    There is buried in the forum a long discussion in which the author of "Grey Wolf" seeking to push his book was really taken to task and has his theories dismembered, he was at one stage threatening "legal action" on some members.
    I recall asking Gerrard Williams why having established that Hitler had two daughters alive and well in South America and having come so far he would not carry on and locate them, he fobbed me off saying that this would be for someone else to do.
    (For someone trying to prove his case beyond any and all reasonable doubt a rather half-hearted answer.).

    Professor Richard Evans has a book on various aspects of " alternative history" including "Hiter's Escape to South America" he will I am sure fully explain how and why it is an utter crock of junk, in an evidenced-based manner similar to that which Luke Daly-Groves did.
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0190083050/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
     
  12. James2019

    James2019 Member

  13. In my opinion he committed suicide and his body was hastily burned as they wanted to flee the advancing Russians. His and Eva Braun's remains are locked up in a Russian vault somewhere and they used the skull fragments to say that's all was left ! Obviously DNA/Forensic testing was available back then. I do like some of the "conspiracy theories" though !
     
  14. Tim L

    Tim L Member

    Has anyone been watching the TV series 'Hunting Hitler?' I would recommend anyone to watch, if you haven't you've been missing a very interesting series but you'd need to see all the programmes from the first to the last.
     
  15. James2019

    James2019 Member

    hi Tim L i have watched that,
     
  16. Tim L

    Tim L Member

    They are uncovering an impressive amount of evidence that Hitler and a lot of high ranking Nazis did actually survive and escape to South America. I know that many will be sceptical and unbelieving but the evidence thus far is very compelling.
     
  17. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    I have watched it.
    (Similar to how you sometimes watch 'The Office' - "Christ... what's he gonna say next?!")
    It really isn't.

    An article by Mr Daly-Groves (as mentioned above) makes a good start in response to this nonsense.
    No, Hitler Did Not Survive WW2! – Debunking Four Outlandish Conspiracy Theories About the Fate of the Führer

    I'd say he was currently the most active proponent against rubbish like Hunting Hitler & Grey Wolf, though I see Richard Evans has a book coming out on 'Hitler Conspiracies' that also examines the survival mythology.

    I mean, he's only dedicating a rather solid & growing academic career to this business. He's not a sensational TV programme or anything, but, y'know...
    More links within:
    Luke Daly-Groves | School of History | University of Leeds
     
    ltdan likes this.
  18. ltdan

    ltdan Nietenzähler

    Sigh...
    Adolf Hitler definitely died in 1945 in Berlin, from taking cyanide and a bullet, according to French researchers who were given rare access to fragments of the dictator's teeth held in Moscow.
    In March and July 2017, Russia's secret service the FSB and the Russian state archives authorised a team of researchers to examine the bones of the dictator, for the first time since 1946
    As it stands, the fragment's morphology was "totally comparable" to radiographies of Hitler's skull taken a year before his death, the research found.
    "The teeth are authentic, there is no possible doubt. Our study proves that Hitler died in 1945. We can stop all the conspiracy theories about Hitler. He did not flee to Argentina in a submarine, he is not in a hidden base in Antarctica or on the dark side of the moon," professor Philippe Charlier told AFP.
    Charlier, a specialist in medical and legal anthropology, was also involved in the analysis of the mummified heart of Richard Lionheart.

    BTW, the study is linked in post #4

    Just for fun:
    https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/HITLER, ADOLF_0003.pdf

    FOIA | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

    Federal Bureau of Investigation

    [X-ray of Hitler's head] - Digital Collections - National Library of Medicine
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2020 at 12:28 AM
    canuck and papiermache like this.
  19. canuck

    canuck Token Colonial Patron

    For those who really cannot resist indulging in flights of fantasy regarding Hitler and the Nazi's, at least be well entertained:

     

Share This Page