12th para river Seine August 1944

Discussion in 'Airborne' started by D Moore, Nov 20, 2019.

  1. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Can anyone tell me if reinforcements would of parachuted into France
    In August 1944 to push into Seine with the 6th airborne.
    And if they did
    How would I find out stick numbers etc
    And where they dropped.
    Or did they get there by other means 20191120_182315.jpg
     
  2. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi Dave,

    As far as I am aware all reinforcements would have gone across by sea and then have been fed up to the fighting Battalion by road - possibly through a 6th Airborne Reinforcement Camp en route.

    No need to go in by Parachute.

    Bearing in mind our interaction on your main topic about your father I think you need to start a topic on similar lines to look for a nominal
    Roll/stick numbers of 12 Para who dropped into Normandy overnight 5/6th June 1944 to try and see if your Dad is listed.

    Steve
     
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  3. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Do you think on here steve
    And under which forum ??
    Sorry as I'm no whizkid on computers
    Also I've tried ringing imperial war museum but they dont answer private phone calls
    Apparently you have to go through website
    Had a look and it's a mind field.
    Just thought someone somewhere must have files on the men in 12th para.
    Thank you steve again
     
  4. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi Dave,

    Just start another topic on the Airborne Forces sub forum.

    I wouldn’t bother with museums as all are understaffed and likely can’t cope with everything.

    I’ve just put “12 Para” in the forum search engine and got a good few hits including this one from 5 years ago offering a copy of a book that might be a good starting point for you -

    Para Memories: 12th Parachute Battalion

    Send the OP a Personal message - don’t put your email address on the forum.

    You need to scroll down all the hits on the search engine and you’ll hopefully come across something to assist you.

    Have a look on Paradata site and send the webmaster a message asking for assistance.

    https://www.paradata.org.uk/contact-us

    It’s probably not relevant yet to look in War Diaries.

    The nominal roll for 12 Para ought to be out there somewhere either compiled by an amateur enthusiast or a writer.

    The bibliography in the 12 Para book I mention above will give you some more lines of enquiry.

    Steve
     
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  5. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Super thanks again for your time and effort.
    Steve.
    Should of asked him more questions when he was with us but sadly lost him over 30yrs ago.
     
  6. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    You’re welcome Dave.

    My Dad only spoke of his experiences after he had turned 65 and as he lived until he was 84 I was able to get alot of info from him that I’ve been able to confirm in documents that have become available on the internet, National Archives, Red Cross, MOD Glasgow etc.

    You might want to start a private conversation with forum member Cee who has an interest in Airborne and has contributed to your previous topics. He might be able to point you in the right direction re further research.

    Steve
     
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  7. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Hi,

    I exchanged emails with Dave in the past on his Father's service record which focused on his involvement with the Paras. I don't think I found anything beyond what members here have already turned up.

    To date I haven't run across a 12th Parachute Battalion nominal roll other than the names found in orbats which for the most part are those of Officers. But there could be one out there?

    Regards ...
     
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  8. Sheldrake

    Sheldrake All over the place....

    It looks as if Sidney Moore was a replacement/reinforcement for 12th parachute battalion who arrived in France on 7/8 August 1944. At that time they were in the Orne Bridgehead on the east flank of the allied beachhead. He seems to have served with the unit in France until they were withdrawn with the rest fo 6 AB division once the allies reached the Seine. Op Paddle, the 6th AB Div advance to the Seine is often overlooked in the focus on D Day but was tough fight for a unit neither intended or equipped for mobile warfare.
     
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  9. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Thankyou for your input
    Yes what I've just been reading they still had a tough time pushing through with pockets of stubborn German resistance
    And still taking casualties.
    Dave
     
  10. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Hi Dave,

    I'm not sure how 2 SAS fits into the picture. In Army Form B200B Sheet 2 there is the following entry: "Transferred Army Air Corps, Authy: W.O. Secret Letter 20/MISO/, Rank: Pte, Date: 5/5/44". More numbers and letters follow on which could be part of the same entry?

    I suspect the "Cover for Documents" page is related to the secret letter as under the title "Notes or Letters Written" at the bottom is "Leics". Your father was transferred from the Leicestershire Regt to the AAC on that date. I don't think the letter itself appears in the documents you posted?

    Regards ...
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2019
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  11. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Yes Cee
    I was going to bring that up as I seen in on a file another chap put up on here
    I'll try and find it
    Secret letter what could that mean
    The puzzle thickens
     
  12. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Yes when he was in Lincoln regt
    Any idea how we can find what all this meant upload_2019-11-14_22-12-46.jpeg.jpg
     
  13. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Dave,

    Sorry I haven't a inkling other than perhaps it has a connection to the 2 SAS entry. There doesn't seem to be a follow up with him serving with the SAS. You could try contact Glasgow to see if such a letter was missed, not sure how successful that would be?

    Regards ...
     
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  14. David Woods

    David Woods Active Member

    Some background information regarding the 12th Parachute Battalion in Normandy and the arrival of 4858324 Private Sidney Moore.

    Casualties suffered by the battalion were so high, that on the 18th June, 1944, all of its Rifle Companies were discontinued. The soldiers that remained were formed into a
    Composite Rifle Company (18th June to 3rd July, 1944), commanded by Captain Colin Bliss.

    3rd July, 1944, non parachutist reinforcements from S.W.B. & Glosters, were absorbed into the Battalion allowing A & B Coy's to be reformed.

    9th August 1944, Captain E. Clarke, QM, and 100 OR's joined from U.K.

    Suggest 4858324 Private Sidney Moore arrived with this contingent by sea.

    11th August 1944, Lieutenant J. C. Pope and 12 OR's joined from U.K.

    18th August 1944, 5 officers and 80 OR's from the U.K., joined the Battalion. C Coy reformed under Captain J. Sim.

    Died: 116 Wounded: 413 Missing: 46
     
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  15. Alex1975uk

    Alex1975uk Well-Known Member

    I have the 12 Para book and it does have a breakdown of platoon commanders and platoon Sgts I think? I’ll check later, who’s the chap we are looking for?

    alex.
     
  16. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Sidney Moore 4858324
    Thanks
     
  17. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    Just an update from para data
    And a document they sent me fits in with course and injury he received while on a jump from balloon, 2nd para BATTALION 'B' company as Dad was attached too 20191127_193557.jpg
     
  18. D Moore

    D Moore Active Member

    20191127_193202.jpg
     
  19. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Dave,

    Not sure if this has already been mentioned as your threads are scattered around. The Normandy war diary for 12th Parachute Battalion is available on the Pegasus Archive here. As for the 2nd Parachute Battalion WDs they can be purchased from same site. Paradata as well has info on 2 Para Bn. A note on navigating the Pegasus Archive site. Left clicking will leave you in frames whereas a middle click takes you out of frames and gives the true address if you wish to share a specific page with others.

    On 25/11/41 your Father fractured his left fibula on a parachute landing. This was serious enough to keep him out of action for several months. He did not return to 2 Para Bn until 1/4/42. At that time they were probably located at the Bulford camp. The 1st Airborne Division units during that period moved from their orignal home at Hardwick Hall to the Bulford area. The Hardwick Camp in Derbyshire then became the Airborne Forces Depot and was officially recognized as the Depot and School Airborne Forces (DSAF) in December1942.

    Your Father was posted there during the period 3/7/42 to 27/1/43 when he was transferred to the Leicestershire Regt. A period of almost 6 months. There is no indication what his role was at the Depot from his service records. Being the lad he was he did manage to go AWOL a few times while stationed there ... :)

    Regards ...
     
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  20. Alex1975uk

    Alex1975uk Well-Known Member

    No mention as it only goes down as far as section commander level ( Sergeants)
     
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