25 April 1945. The 'Liberation' of Italy

Discussion in 'Italy' started by vitellino, Apr 25, 2021.

  1. vitellino

    vitellino Senior Member

    Hello everybody who is interested in the Italian Campaign.

    I opened this morning's paper ( I live in Italy) to read for once that it wasn't the the Resistance that had liberated the country on 25 April 1945. No, it was the Americans.

    I quote in translation:

    ..It was the American Army that defeated the Germans...on the headstones in the cemeteries from Syracuse through to Udine, as revealed by Massimo Coltrinari ( the president of a patriotic association) there are names of other ranks and officers from the Hawaian islands, Australians, New Zealanders - even the Maori - Indians, Nepalese, French, Moroccans, Poles, Greeks, and even a few Italians belonging to the Italian Liberation Corps, also Brasilians, Belgians, and members of the Jewish Brigade, but for the main part they are Americans, who fell on Italian soil.

    I just wonder what the British did to not deserve a mention. I expect they were busy dodging it again. The South Africans get short shrift too.

    I have emailed the jouirnalist concerned and hope he will check a few facts - even Wikipedia will do - and rectify his omission.

    Vitellino

    Edited to say that the Canadians weren't worthy of a mention either
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2021
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  2. 4jonboy

    4jonboy Daughter of a 56 Recce

    Hello Janet,

    Thank you for posting this. Makes me wonder what planet this guy is on.
    I'm lost for words; it beggars belief :reallymad:.

    Lesley
     
  3. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    What cock wrote that shite?
     
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  4. 4jonboy

    4jonboy Daughter of a 56 Recce

    Exactly, shove it on farcebook O
     
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  5. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

  6. vitellino

    vitellino Senior Member

    The giornalist is usually reputable. I intend to follow up the source he used.

    I spent about twenty years trying to convince the people round Lake Trasimeno that the area had been liberated by the British and not the Yanks. There was an American field hospital there for a while, and that ìs what has been remembered.
     
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  7. bexley84

    bexley84 Well-Known Member

    It was the Americans, obvs.... easy mistake to make.

    The CWGC lists 29,914 men serving with UK forces and who are buried/in memorial in Italy.

    A few images of some of my Dad's mates and comrades buried in Italy and whose famillies we keep in touch with.

    Eddie Mayo
    Jimmy Barnes
    Beauchamp Butler
    Edward Graham
    Ion Goff
    Lawrie Franklyn-Vaile
    John Geoghegan
    Joe Beglin
    David Marshall.


    IMG_2024.PNG
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Apr 26, 2021
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  8. 17thDYRCH

    17thDYRCH Senior Member

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  9. vitellino

    vitellino Senior Member

    17thDYRCH, I will send him this information but I don't think he reads English.

    Here's what I have discovered about Massimo Coltrinari, credited with the quote in my original post:

    He has had a long and distinguished career. A Brigadier General, he has held the title of Professor of Military History in the faculty of Strategic Studies at the "La Sapienza" (University of Rome) and since October 2014 has been Director of Studies on Military Valour at the Nastro Azzurro Institute, an association for those who won a decoration during the Second World War.

    He has written numerous volumes and unfortunately the journalist did not say in his article which one this quote comes from.
     
  10. Carmelo

    Carmelo Member

    Vitellino I am from Italy. Please if possible let me know more details about the newspaper and the journalist. I would like to reply to him.
    I live in Umbria and no US troops crossed my region in 1944. Umbria was liberated by British 8th army and Commonwealth troops.
    This morning I participated to the Italian liberation day commemoration. The authorities put flowers under the commemorative plaque with the names of the local partisans fallen during the war.
    talking with my fellow citizen I told that should be important to put an additional plaque with the names of the British soldiers.
    Then this evening I was reading articles on the internet about the British army in Umbria in 1944 and I read your post.



     
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  11. Carmelo

    Carmelo Member

    Searching the forum I noticed that in the plaque in Spoleto Umbria there are the names of two British soldiers
    - Campbell David and Eatwell Frank
    And that they escaped from a Pow camp and joined the local patriots.
    There are others names that can be British
    - Sanderson (just the surname)
    - Schuttu John (maybe misspelled )
     

    Attached Files:

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  12. Carmelo

    Carmelo Member

    Airmen & Others

    Here it is.
    They are buried in the Assisi war cemetery

    Two South Africans, Privates T.E. SANDERSON, 1 Royal Durban Light Infantry, and J. F. SCHUTTE, 1 South African Irish,
     
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  13. vitellino

    vitellino Senior Member

    Send me a private message regarding the journalist.

    There is also a plaque in Norcia.

    norcia memorial eatwell, campbell, sanderson schutte 2.JPG

    I lived in Umbria from 1994-2017, apart from 4 years at Torrita di Siena, and am now back in Tuscany. My husband was born in Castiglione del Lago.

    All four above were escapers and all joined the partisans.

    Campbell and Eatwell were the victims of a War Crime - file in the National Archives, London, and are buried in Moro River War Cemetery. Sanderson and Schutte - both South Africans like Eatwell - were killed during an action near Castelluccio.

    You can read about them in my book the Long Trail Home (Lulu.com) or if you prefer the Italian version La Lunga Via del Ritorno (pub. Morlachi press, Perugia ). They also appear in Marcello Marecellini's book about Ernesto Melis.(Mursia)


    Vitellino (Janet Kinrade Dethick)

    Edited to say: I am not good about publicising myself but should say that the quote regarding Assisi is from my website.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2021
  14. Carmelo

    Carmelo Member

    Dear Janet, Thank you for your reply and for your information.

    I will call Spoleto City Hall in order to try to correct the names in the plaque.
    My plan is to do some research in order to find out names of other British / Commonwealth Soldiers fallen in Spoleto - Foligno - Terni area in June 1944.
    Also, I am really sorry hearing about the war crime related to Campbell and Eatwell. I will try to find out more information here in Spoleto / Norcia area.

    Carmelo
     
  15. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    If you want to get your head around how absolutely useless the Italian Armed Forces were - which helped bring down the Germans in the Mediterranean, you should read Hitler's Italian Allies by MacG Knox. It is a cracking read.

    Regards

    Frank
     
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  16. Carmelo

    Carmelo Member

    Dear Frank I know that. Thank you for your advice.
    My gran father was fighting in Soviet Union with ARMIR (Italian Army expedition in Russia) and the retreat was a disaster. He went back to Italy alive by miracle. He always counted me that Italians were coming back walking for a lot of miles with bad quality shoes, and in the meanwhile Germans were passing on board of trains making jokes about them.

    On the other hand please know that in my region Umbria there was antifascist rebellion and quite strong partisans units (even the first ‘free’ territory in the mountains in 1943 - Monteleone di Spoleto Leonessa - behind the Gustav line).
    several villages and families hosted allied refugees soldiers.
     
  17. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    Carmelo.

    I am not familiar with anti-fascist organisations nor the partisan bit so I defer to Vitellino who does. I trust her judgement.

    My reading is limited to the Italian Armed Forces - massively underfunded, very, very poorly led by their Officer Corps, a highly politicised leadership cadre, a thoroughly corrupt procurement system, no war fighting doctrine to speak of, and lots obsolete equipment - all led by a fool.

    The story of the Italian Alpine Corps’ retreat in Russia is one of tragedy and betrayal by the Germans who never treated them as allies. Sacrifice on the Steppe by Hope Hamilton is excellent.

    Regards

    Frank
     
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  18. Carmelo

    Carmelo Member

    Frank Thank you for your reply. Very interesting. I will look for this book.
    Not to be treated as allies by the Germans Army in that time sounds like an honor.
    As per the Italian Armed Forces I totally agree with your comments. I can add ‘led by a fool and a lot of war criminals’. (Never punished unfortunately!).
    In order to spend a word for ‘my people’ I want to say something unconnected: for example John Basilone one of the most famous heroes of WW2 (an US marine fallen in Iwo Jima) was born in a family from Benevento, the same place of my gran father.
    And a few among the famous US ‘band of brothers’ were from Italy.
    As per the Italian partisans I think they was relatively ineffective during the Italian Campaign (excepting for some cases in Piemonte and Emilia Romagna in northern Italy). There was an Italian division (Cremona division) under Canadian command very strong in Emilia Romagna. And very effective ‘bands’ in Piemonte. Maybe the ‘resistance’ in Italy was the strongest in Western Europe, same level than France.
    In general I hate that Italian media and ‘thinkers’ every April 25th (liberation day in Italy) talk a lot about ‘the partisans’, completely forgetting Allied soldiers. This is the reason because I would like to find out - with the kindly help of Vitellino - more information about British soldiers in Umbria.
    For example my town was ‘liberated’ on June 14th 1944 and the British 8th army arrived on June 16th. But is unfair and stupid to say that my town was liberated by the partisans, because the Germans evacuated the town since the British Army was 10 miles away.
    I will try to do my best in my local dimension in order to give British and Commonwealth soldiers the memory and honor they Deserve.
     
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  19. vitellino

    vitellino Senior Member

    Update.

    I have received a message saying that the recipient's inbox is full.

    So much for my attempt to communicate with the journalist,

    Vitellino
     
  20. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    If I can ask a rather stupid question, what happened on the 25th exactly? I was looking at this recently because a book about one of the Italian divisions mentions where they were on the date of cease-fire. The formal surrender was on May 2nd, right? Was there a cease fire from the 25th?
     
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