...And In Search of a Signaller (UPDATED WITH A CLUE!!)

Discussion in 'Royal Signals' started by Jonathan Ball, Aug 25, 2010.

  1. Jonathan Ball

    Jonathan Ball It's a way of life.

    Hi everyone

    Following on from my previous post could I now turn your attention to the following gentleman? my mate Greg's Grandfather.

    He was 2571317 Corporal Richard Hesp of the Royal Corps of Signals. He was a recipiant of the Africa Star medal with a 1st Army Clasp which I believe would mean he took part in the TORCH landings and an Italian Star medal.

    As a Signaller would I be right in thinking that he would have been attached to various regiments? If so would it mean having to apply for his service record?

    I know from research into my own Grandfather's service that an application for a service record requires a considerable wait so i'm hoping some kind person here my just have an idea or piece of information that could be helpful

    Regards

    Jonathan
     
  2. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    LoyalLanc

    I can well understand your feelings on the waiting for service records BUT - I don;t see any way around this - at this time - you are not necessarily correct in stating that he took part in Torch - but he certainly was in the North African campaign at some point or other with 1st Army . As you know the initial landings were of a small British corps of some four Divisions - this was enlarged in the spring by another three divisions which compounds your problem as all smaller units had signals personnel attached - and all of them managed to get themselves into Italy eventually.

    As an example of the problem - 78th Division had three Infantry brigades of three battalions - each company having some signals people - then there were the Artillery- Engineeers- Service - Medical -and all sorts of ancillery personnel - all having to stay in contact - then there was 6th Armoured - 4th Div - 1st Airborne - 1st Div - 46th Div - two Army Tank Bdes - and you are looking for ONE man .....if you were to find his unit - then perhaps this would get us closer..but.....
    Cheers
     
  3. Jonathan Ball

    Jonathan Ball It's a way of life.

    This is a photo of Richard Hesp that has been given to me today. I'm particularly interested in the patch on the arm of the Gentleman to the left. I have been taking a looking at Divisional Insignia and I think it looks a little like the Oak Tree of the 46th Division. Would anyone agree with my theory and would this tie in with his service in Algeria, Tunisia and Italy?
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    100% 46 Div
    with Africa Star medal ribbon
     
  5. Jonathan Ball

    Jonathan Ball It's a way of life.

    Nice one.
    Thanks Owen.
     
  6. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Loyallanc

    Certainly appears like the Oak tree of the 46th Div - so now it seems that you have cut the odds down to 15,000 / 1

    The photo would indicate a late Algeria/ Tunisia time when the Africa Star was first issued - around May/June '43 and before they set off to become floating reserve for the Sicilian Landings on July 10th '43 - and then on to Salerno with Xth Corps with US 5th Army on Sept 9th '43...and on in the Italian campaign.....finally to Austria in May '45.
    The photo also indicates a close group headed by a Corporal - possibly a Regimental or Brigade group - a Divisional group would be much bigger than four men

    Cheers
     
  7. Jonathan Ball

    Jonathan Ball It's a way of life.

    Thanks for that Tom. The Austrian angle fits nicely as we do have some postcards, which alas are basically just of the 'here i am and i'm fine' type that were from Graz.
     
  8. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Loyal lanc
    The 46th Div were centred around the Graz area in SE Austria after the war as you can see dealing with stragglers - bad guys - and mainly a division of Cossacks who turned up complete with Horses, wives and children - who had to be handed over to the Russians to their deaths in too many cases - a truly tragic story.

    But just one of many in dealing with the Russians at that time...We all had those experiences - the 78th Div over at Spittal to the SW - and the 6th Armoured around the Central Judenberg / Knittelfeld areas.....not a happy time !
    Cheers
     
  9. Jonathan Ball

    Jonathan Ball It's a way of life.

    Now that is interesting Tom as I received an e-mail last night from Richard's daughter which stated that he had learnt to speak German and had a picked up a rudimentary grasp of Russian as part of his duties. She said it was because his job was to listen in on German and Russian signals. Presumably it must have been low grade stuff if it was sent en clair?
     
  10. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Jonathon - not necessarily so as the German's never did figure out that we had cracked their enigma codes- or were very careless - we all had the opportunity to learn German through the Educational Corps -we would go to the local schools in the evenings - to learn the basics to get by - it worked for some people but now and again it got twisted - as one night we were picking up a bunch of girls to go to a dance in a neigbouring village - one girl got on and she was smothered in perfume...so one of our lads who was learning the language said " Du stinken sehr gut" whereupon she belted him ....!
    Cheers
     
  11. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Thought you might be interested to read the Epilogue from the 46th Division history.
     

    Attached Files:

  12. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    After taking some 10,000 pictures of files this week I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that knowing a regimnt doesn't mean they were with that regiment.

    In 1940 diaries I have seen KRRC in Royal Engineers units, Guards in randon units and ROAC in infantry battalions and so on and so on. Even if you know the cap badge service records are the way forward to really be as near as dam it sure who they were with.

    Cheers
    Andy
     

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