Firefly development

From Dick Taylor's most recent publication, Armoured Warfare in the British Army 1939-1945 (ISBN:9781399081030), in which he suggests the development involved Brighty and Witheridge (unofficially), and that it was Witheridge who 'used his contacts in the shape of the Director Royal Armoured Corps, Major General Raymond Briggs, another RTR officer, to get the project sanctioned':

I would be interested to know, from 'those in the know' how close the above is to what has been read, and source documents accessed, by others.

 

That's very kind - I actually don't remember it myself! But was it a name given by the Ministry of Supply, like "Archer"?

 

The trouble with the Dick Taylor account is that there is no structure as to how the Firefly happened. How does Raymond Briggs high up in the War Office get William Kilbourn, an underling in the Ministry of Supply, to comply with his wishes? Kilbourn had to be told what to do by Bill Durrant, who in turn had to be told what to do either by Claude Gibb or by Gibb's deputy George MacLeod Ross. Both of the latter would have been aware of the possibility of putting a 17 pounder in the Sherman long before Raymond Briggs was.

I think I know how the early Firefly development was organised, and who the key figure was (NOT Brighty, Witheridge or Kilbourn), but this is not something I am going to expand upon until I get much more information to confirm my inklings.

 

Not as far as I am aware. "Achilles" was definitely given to the M10, but the Royal Artillery looked askance at MoS nomenclature.

 

Can I ask where that came from? I've been trying to look into those two equipments for donkeys years, so far that I know I've only ever found a picture of each and the one (utterly useless) document at Kew.

 

PM me and I'll see what I can rustle up for you.

 

Report recording 1st use of IC in Italy with LdSH. Oct 44.

 

Can you post the photos of these 2 vehicles?

The Firefly and Mayfly did exist. The Firefly was a Humber Armoured Car fitted with a 6 pounder gun for the Airborne role, and the Mayfly was a Morris Light Recce Car fitted with a 6 pounder for the same purpose. They were conceived by Claude Gibb during the second half of 1942 to be carried in the Hamilcar glider and give Airborne troops a mobile anti-tank equipment. Both names are essentially puns, if you think about them for a moment.

 

Morris Firefly is here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/TankPorn/comments/xs7pql/experimental_morris_light_reconnaissance_car/

Mayfly is here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/868stt/heres_a_canadian_humber_armoured_car_with_a_6/

Note ignore the comments that this vehicle was Canadian - it wasn't.

 

I think I read that once and laughed, because history has said "no" to that one.

 

Fascinates me how the confusion came about. The actual Firefly and the Sherman "Firefly" are about as different as you can get.

I can only guess that the two prototype vehicles were in close proximity at Lulworth or somewhere, and someone pointed at the Sherman and said "what's that thing?" and the person next to them thought they were pointing at the Morris car and said "Oh, that's a Firefly".