Hi Chaps, Wondering if anyone could help to clarify a question or two regarding the Glider Pilot Regiment during Operation Varsity on this very wet and windy night. I'm aware of the large-scale programme to bolster the ranks of the GPR after their losses from D-day and Arnhem in particular, from the extensive and under-utilised pool of trained RAF pilots, prior to Operation Varsity, and their successful integration into the regiment. However, having recently read ' I Just Wanted to Fly' by Bernard Osborn & David Pasley it appears that Osborn and other experienced glider pilots of the GPR were at the time of the Rhine Crossing undertaking further training and he was rather miffed at not being involved and was rather of the opinion that they were "being kept out of the way". My question is, was this just a coincidence that a small group of experienced men were not available for Varsity - Osborn does not indicate how many were on the course - or were there others held back? I have not seen mention of this elsewhere, always having assumed that every available experienced pilot would have been thrown into the fray. However, in retrospect it does seem prudent that perhaps a cadre of experienced pilots may have been held back to provide a means of training up another large intake of RAF replacements should casualties have been excessive during Operation Varsity as they were at Arnhem. Varsity was by no means the last planned or proposed use of glider troops in the European theatre and there was of course a possible further need of the GPR in the fight against the Japanese. Can anyone throw some further light on this matter - I am assuming that the GPR War Diary will show operational strength at the time but does it break this down into pilot numbers at the time of Operation Varsity and if so does it further indicate how many were RAF attachments or original regulars? Everyone's opinion welcome. Cheers Dave
Hi Dave, Here are a couple of statistical tables from the GPR Op Varsity report on the numbers and fate of Army and RAF glider pilots used. Sorry I can't help with the bigger question of whether there was policy in place to hold back more experienced pilots from participation. Regards ...
Hi Cee, Thanks for taking the trouble to load up those stats - very interesting reading - as I haven't come across them before at TNA. Can you recall the source of the records? - I am assuming that it was compiled quite soon after the event as large numbers are still reported as missing. Didn't appreciate quite how many RAF pilots were used on Varsity until I saw this table so very illuminating - every little bit helps to build the bigger picture, so much appreciated. Regards Dave
Dave, It's from "The Report on Operation Varsity" by the GPR dated 19/5/45 which comes from an Archive Britain Campaign (ABC) CD sent to me by member Alex. While rummaging through some folders I came across this photo of S/Sgt. Jim Wallwork DFM with a group of RAF glider pilots. Wallwork flew gliders into Siciliy, Normandy(Deadstick), Arnhem and Germany. On Op Varsity he piloted a Hamilcar carrying a 17 pounder. So a very experienced and capable glider pilot whose talents were put to good use on the Rhine Crossing. I'm not sure of the photo source so I hope they don't mind me posting. Regards ...
Dave, Cee, A very, very short extract from "A Story of Arnhem by 3861924 S/Sgt W Holcroft, The Glider Pilot Regiment". The second paragraph of three written by Laurie Weeden puts into words which you have both rightly touched on in this thread. Straight talking as you'd expect. Best wishes, Jim.
Short clip of Laurie Weeden Laurie Weedon | Glider Pilot I thoroughly recommend the "legasee" site and it's aims. Enjoy.
Hi Cee, That's a new one on me - having photographed hundreds of pages at The National Archives it good to be surprised by a new set of images & information from a different source. It has always amused me that Jim Wallwork was the most off-target glider pilot on the Sicily invasion - I seem to recall about 57 miles from his LZ - not being his fault of course and then next time he was in action performing one of the most amazing pin-point landings of the war at the coup-de-main D-day operation and all in the dark - one extreme to the other!! Cheers Dave
Hi Jim, Thanks for the heads up on the booklet - I do have it in my vast library of airborne books but I didn't think to refer to it regarding the subsequent Operation Varsity. Will check out the website as well as I haven't come across that one before. Looks interesting. Regards Dave
Dave, I'm not sure if this helps much but since you don't have the report I'll post a few pages with general comments on the integration of RAF glider pilots into the GPR. It was decided that the Regiment should be split roughly 50/50 percent Army and RAF. From the charts above out of a total of 880 gliders pilots used on Varsity 399 were Army and 481 were RAF - an approximate percentage split of 45/55 (excluding the 10 Army administrators) In the second paragraph we are told after Arnhem the GPR had 48 Officers and 666 other Ranks left. How many of those were administration I'm not sure. But it does seem there were quite a few Army glider pilots not used on the Operation? Regards ...
Wow, thanks guys that really puts a whole new perspective, for me, on the training and use of glider pilots for Varsity. Not only did the RAF replacements undergo rapid glider and infantry training before their first experience of battle they were actually the majority of those utilised which is pretty scary considering what their payloads were. I know that in most cases the RAF men were teamed up with an experienced GPR man but I have read of some gliders going in with 1st and 2nd pilots as both RAF newbies. I appreciate that every man had to have a first mission but considering what a disaster Sicily proved to be for the Glider pilots - through no fault of their own - it is entirely to the credit of the RAF guys that the glider landings were so successful during Varsity. I shall definitely trawl through the GPR War Diaries between Sep 44 - Mar 45 next time I am at Kew to explore the strength of the regiment but it is obvious now that a large cadre of experienced GPR men were held back from the operation and the intention was to create a rapid and large influx of battle-hardened replacements from the ranks of the RAF men. I am also assuming (perhaps wrongly?) that between Arnhem and Varsity there was also a continuation of training army replacements for the GPR and that it was realised early in 1945 that the numbers were not adequate for imminent large scale operations. Not to bore anyone but working out some casualty figures for 24th March, 1945 I've come up with the following rates of attrition amongst the 97 glider pilots that lost their lives that day (not including Pte Andrew Robertson who was Army Catering Corps attached to F Squadron). Also, not including A/Sgt John Stevens GPR killed in action 26/03/45 and Flying Officer Stephane Mansell RAFVR beaten to death by Hitler Youth whilst attempting to escape from a POW column 29/03/45. RAF Glider Pilots killed in action 59 = 60.8% of total GPR Glider Pilots killed in action 38 = 39.2% of total percentage of RAF Glider pilots killed against number in action = 12.26% percentage of GPR Glider pilots killed against number in action = 9.50% Pretty sobering figures and of course not even including wounded men. Dave
There’s a book about RAF Glider Pilots and Op Varsity called “Wot! No Engines” that was published in 2002
Thanks for the recommendation but do already have a copy - very good read. Great title! Just re-reading On Wings of Healing by Lt.Col. Howard N.Cole which has an interesting chapter on the airborne medical service contribution during Operation Varsity and states that gliderborne casualties were twice that of parachute troops and that the effective fighting strength of the 6th Airborne Division was reduced by a third (killed, wounded & missing) within 48 hours but all objectives were taken as planned.
Hi Dave, Just to add to your original post; my father Lt. William Macdonald was an experienced glider pilot having joined the GPR in March 1942, been through Sciliy, Italy, Greece and Southern France, but does not appear to have taken part in Op. Varsity although he would have been available. It is also possible that he did take part as I believe the records on who took part are incomplete. John
Hello Cee, I bought that CD from "Archive Britain" in the early 2000s - recently I tried to open it but it seems to be defective. Apparently the "Archive Britain Campaign" has ceased to exist, their material is not for sale anymore - I cannot find anything online, not even in the used books stores (not surprisingly). Is there a remote chance to get you to copy the pages on the overall losses of Varsity? That would be great! I quoted the pages on the of Varsity overall losses in my book, the report estimated British fatalities at around 600 (it says that so many makeshift graves had been localized on the battlefield, also stating that maybe 700 bodies of British airborne personnel had died, which includes who later died of wounds. It would be good to have access to this pages and statistics again. The 600 figure comes very close - I am consolidating the exact losses at the moment. It is sobering to be confronted with all those names and lives lost - that 24th of March was a day of immense suffering. And then to think of all the families who were informed in the following day and weeks... Thank you, Alex
.. well, and how does one find out who died of wounds much later? I do not mean those who were brought to hospitals on the west bank of the Rhine, i.e. to Kapellen and Issum - I found most of those who died there between March 25th and March 29th. But some casualties were brought back to Britain, I should think... like Captain Kenneth Boss who died there in June 1945. Any idea how to find out more a about the long-term effects?
Hi Alex (alberk), Now that Geoff's Search Engine is gone I don't think there is a way to search creatively using CWGC data. As you probably know the Pegasus Archive has unit RoH's for Op Varsity and Germany. For example Capt Kenneth Boss shows up there under 2 FOU. Of course many men also died in battles that occurred afterwards in the drive to the Baltic. What you need are casualty lists for March 24th and immediately after to discover who actually died of wounds later. Do those exist? Alex C. sent me the ABC CDs in digital form which I think can be converted to CDs if so inclined. One was a Battlefield Tour CD and the other was on Varsity itself. I couldn't find much on overall casualties and deaths amongst all the data but I could haved missed it? If you like I could send it all your way. Regards ...
Hello Cee, thanks for getting back to me. I have no knowledge of actual 1945 casualty lists in the archives. The CWGC site is a help, especially the Graves Concentration Report Forms filled in in 1947 when the bodies were recovered - however, they won't be useful to find out who much later died of wounds sustained during Varsity. Do I understand you correctly that you have the ABC CD in digital form? Then there would be no need to convert it to a CD... I would very much appreciate if you could send me the "Report on Varsity" as a file. I have the old CD with the Battlefield Tour and it still accessible and works fine, as opposed to the one with the Report. Best regards Alex
