Pillbox Two-Storey: Brookside, Yeading ,Middlesex

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by CL1, Nov 26, 2018.

  1. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    The Pillbox is of a two-storey design with access to the 1st floor via a metal ladder which is still solidly in place.Very cramped ground floor and 1st floor.
    In poor condition with ever encroaching housing development.A once clear view across flat land is now obscured by dense undergrowth and trees.Access to the actual site is through a broken fence and climb over a mud bank .Entry to the Pillbox is easy.
    upload_2018-11-26_21-32-17.png

    From the Hillingdon Council website.Locally listed.
    Statement of significance/ Reasons for designation Architectural:
    A two storey, hexagonal pillbox, in brick with stone coping to parapet. Much vandalised, and in poor condition. Historic: The only remaining one of a ring of such pillboxes that surrounded the Royal Ordnance Factory run by Imperial Chemical Industries (ICI) at Yeading, during WW2.

    upload_2018-11-26_21-32-42.png upload_2018-11-26_21-33-0.png upload_2018-11-26_21-33-10.png upload_2018-11-26_21-33-22.png upload_2018-11-26_21-33-34.png upload_2018-11-26_21-33-45.png upload_2018-11-26_21-33-56.png upload_2018-11-26_21-34-7.png upload_2018-11-26_21-34-22.png upload_2018-11-26_21-34-32.png upload_2018-11-26_21-34-43.png upload_2018-11-26_21-35-0.png upload_2018-11-26_21-35-10.png upload_2018-11-26_21-35-21.png upload_2018-11-26_21-35-32.png upload_2018-11-26_21-35-43.png upload_2018-11-26_21-35-58.png upload_2018-11-26_21-36-14.png upload_2018-11-26_21-36-30.png upload_2018-11-26_21-36-43.png upload_2018-11-26_21-36-57.png upload_2018-11-26_21-37-12.png upload_2018-11-26_21-37-25.png upload_2018-11-26_21-37-36.png upload_2018-11-26_21-37-50.png upload_2018-11-26_21-38-3.png upload_2018-11-26_21-38-14.png upload_2018-11-26_21-38-25.png upload_2018-11-26_21-38-37.png upload_2018-11-26_21-38-54.png upload_2018-11-26_21-39-5.png upload_2018-11-26_21-39-17.png upload_2018-11-26_21-39-29.png upload_2018-11-26_21-39-40.png upload_2018-11-26_21-39-52.png upload_2018-11-26_21-40-3.png upload_2018-11-26_21-40-14.png upload_2018-11-26_21-40-26.png upload_2018-11-26_21-40-38.png upload_2018-11-26_21-40-53.png upload_2018-11-26_21-41-5.png upload_2018-11-26_21-41-17.png
     
  2. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    I have just applied for this to be nationally listed not just locally.
     
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  3. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Update received today



    World War II pill box, Brookside, Yeading, Hayes


    Thank you for your application to add the above building to the List of Buildings of Special Architectural or Historic Interest. If you have any further contact details for the owner or owners of the building and have not already provided us with them, I would be grateful if you could forward them to me.


    We are now beginning our assessment of the building. Once we have carried out this preliminary assessment we will send you a copy of our consultation report. This report will set out the factual information on which we will base our recommendation. At that stage you will be invited to make any comments you wish to about the building. We will consider all representations made before finalising our assessment and making our recommendation to the Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport. We will notify you of the Secretary of State’s decision in due course
     
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  4. Red Goblin

    Red Goblin Senior Member

    Let's hope they ask HMLR because Sarah Sing's report seemed not to show it as council-owned - see pA225. That said, though of course, the council should also know who does now own it if you do need to spoon-feed them after all.

    I'm nostalgically-intrigued, BTW, never to have found this so near to my 1960s school bike commute - nearest point c/o Streetmap - but then I also seem to remember the fence being forbiddingly high & impenetrable and there was no need, anyway, with more accessible wasteland alongside the canal to act as our strangely-UXB-free adventure playground.
     
  5. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    The fence in the field runs parallel with the location and it is fenced off however there appear to be contractors who have bulldozed land close to it and the fence by the gates was missing in the Cygnet way area
     
  6. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Still ongoing and now being sent to the Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport to be assessed for listing.

    Further to our previous correspondence, I am writing to advise you that we have completed our initial assessment of the above building to consider whether it has special architectural or historic interest.



    Please follow the link below to download a copy of our consultation report, which sets out the factual information upon which we will base our recommendation to the Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport

    Historic England (Designation) Consultation Report 27 November 2019 Page 1 of 4 Case Name: World War II pill box, Brookside, Yeading Case Number: 1464812 Background We have been asked to consider the two-storey pill box in Brookside, Hayes, Yeading for listing.
    History The earliest examples of pillboxes date from the First World War, although this example, along with many thousands of others, was constructed as part of a national defence programme in response to the threat of German invasion in 1940. The programme involved strengthening coastal defences and constructing defensive lines, or 'stop lines', stretching inland in order to slow down the progress of an invading force. During the Second World War, pillboxes were built along the stop lines and at nodal points, such as towns and villages, military bases and munitions factories. Twelve basic designs were approved by the War Office, although these were often varied to accommodate local considerations. Due to the inflexibility of their design and high cost, the deployment of pillboxes came under scrutiny in 1941 and the Home Office issued orders to stop building them in February 1942. The pillbox in Brookside, Hayes, Yeading is a two-storey variation of a FW3/22 design; the single-storey version was the second most common type of pillbox construction. Typically they have embrasures suitable for rifles or light machine guns and are usually bulletproof with walls of 30cm thick. The first floor in this example appears to have been used for housing a tripod-mounted Browning machine gun. The pillbox was built to protect a munitions factory to the north run by the private chemical company Imperial Chemical Industries at Yeading during the Second World War to help supply munitions for the war effort similar to the government funded Royal Ordnance Factories. The factory was demolished in the late C20. It was protected by a ring of pillboxes of which this structure is the only one that survives. Details Pillbox, built in around 1940 to 1941, a two-storey variation of a type FW3/22.

    PLAN: hexagonal footprint
    MATERIALS: brick and reinforced concrete. EXTERIOR: the walls are constructed of brick with concrete surrounds to the embrasures, and a flat reinforced-concrete ceiling at ground-floor level and a roof of the same construction. The ground floor has embrasures with stepped splays in five of the sides and an entrance with the remains of a small look out in the sixth to the rear. The first floor has flat rectangular embrasures on all sides. INTERIOR: there is a central ground-floor Y-shaped anti-ricochet brick wall and attached to one side is a metal ladder which leads through a hole in the concrete ceiling to the upper level.

    Selected Sources Websites Images of pillbox, accessed 27 November 2019 from Pillbox: S0007012, Brookside, Yeading (C) J Taylor Images of pillbox, accessed 27 November 2019 from Pillbox Two-Storey: Brookside, Yeading Middlesex Review of Local List of Buildings of Architectural or Historic Importance: Pillbox, Yeading
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2019
  7. ARPCDHG

    ARPCDHG Member

    Keep up the good work CL1, you're doing a grand job. It is a rare type of pillbox and sadly, all too many of these important war memorials are being destroyed by developers etc.
     
  8. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Received from Department for Digital Culture Media and Sport


    CONCLUSION After examining all the records and other relevant information and having carefully considered the architectural and historic interest of this case, the criteria for listing are not fulfilled. The pillbox in Brookside, Yeading, Hillingdon is not recommended for listing. REASONS FOR DESIGNATION DECISION The two-storey pillbox at Brookside, Yeading, Hillingdon is not recommended for listing for the following principal reasons: Level of architectural interest: * it is recognised that this is a relatively rare example of a two-storey pillbox; however, it does not compare well with other nationally listed examples which have greater group value or structural interest. Level of historic interest: * although its original function, defending an important factory which contributed to the Second World War effort affords it clear local interest, it is now a largely isolated defensive structure and the associated military structures which formerly defended the now-demolished munitions factory have been lost. Countersigning comments: Agreed. This pillbox has lost its historic context and although it is unusual for having two storeys, it does not have the degree of structural interest to be listed in the national context.

    My reply but have not heard back yet


    Dear Si/Madam
    I request you please review this request for listing and place it on the national listing.
    The building is a rare example.
    I do not agree it has lost its historic context.
    I assume that due to house building in the local area it would be more convenient to pull down the structure rather than keep it. This historical structure can be given context by an information board stating the history of the area and the reason for the pillbox.
    Please advise me if the structure is to be removed.
     
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  9. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Attached notification report

    Historic England Advice Report 07 May 2020 Page 1 of 6 Case Name: Second World War pillbox, Brookside, Yeading Case Number: 1464812 Background We have been asked to consider the two-storey pill box in Brookside, Hayes, Yeading for listing. Asset(s) under Assessment Facts about the asset(s) can be found in the Annex(es) to this report. Annex List Entry Number Name Heritage Category HE Recommendation 1 1465506 Two-storey Type-22 pillbox approximately 70m east of Cygnet Way Listing Do not add to List Visits Date Visit Type none No Visit / Data from other sources Context The pillbox appears on Hillingdon Council’s Local List of Buildings of Architectural or Historic Importance. It does not stand within a conservation area. The owner of the pillbox was notified of the listing assessment; however, no response has been received. The assessment of the pillbox has therefore been based on available information, including recent external and internal images found online. Assessment CONSULTATION The applicant, the owner’s representative, the local authority and the Historic Environment Record were invited to comment on the factual details of the case as part of the consultation process. The applicant has acknowledged receipt of the consultation report. The HER responded providing the monument report for the pillbox, this has been included in the Sources. No other responses were received. DISCUSSION The Principles of Selection for Listed Buildings (November 2018) states that from 1850 to 1945, because of the greatly increased number of buildings erected and the much larger numbers that have survived, progressively greater selection is necessary. The Historic England Listing Selection Guide for Military Structures (December 2017) notes that when considering pillboxes for listing, claims to special interest will include rarity of type; group relationship with other defence structures (including tank traps and road blocks); survival; and their built form. Given the very considerable numbers of items that survive, considerable discretion should be used in their selection, with particular attention being justified for those which directly illustrate their intended function as part of a key defensive line or nodal point. Where fittings like wooden Historic England Advice Report 07 May 2020 Page 2 of 6 shutters survive, or the pillbox has internal signage, or painted aids to aircraft recognition, or wall art, the case for designation will be strengthened. The pillbox at Brookside, Yeading, Hillingdon is two-storey variation of a Type-22 pillbox. It is unclear if it was purpose-built as a two-storey structure, or if the second storey was added later for the purpose of either observation or for housing a tripod-mounted Browning machine gun. Internally it retains a metal ladder which provides access to the upper storey. The main structure survives relatively well, although there has been some limited loss of bricks, particularly around the entrance. It was originally one of a ring of military defensive structures which encircled a now-demolished munitions factory; the other defensive structure has been removed. Two-storey pillboxes are relatively rare variations of often more standard pillbox types and there are around four which are currently listed. These include a converted two-storey Type-24 pillbox on the Stroudwater Canal, Gloucestershire; although the Brookside pillbox has had fewer alterations, the Stroudwater pillbox includes a surviving rooftop gun emplacement and illustrates a key point on a former stop line, Stop Line Green which ran from Burnham-on-Sea in Somerset to Newnham in Gloucestershire. The two-storey Type-24 pillbox at Steeton, Keighley is listed along with two fire posts which defended a Royal Ordnance Factory (demolished); while the pillbox is listed as a rare example of its kind, it also listed as a good group along with the fire posts. Another listed Type-24 two-storey pillbox is located on Newcastle Road, Market Drayton, Shropshire, and stands on the former Western Command Stop Line Number 8. Finally, there is a two-storey cylindrical pillbox, probably a variation of a Norcon-Type CP/6/40/11, on the east side of Worcester and Birmingham Canal, Strichley; while this is a relatively isolated structure, it is listed as an unusual example of a two-storey pillbox structure, with a pillbox on the ground floor and an open lookout or watchtower above. In comparison, the two-storey pillbox at Brookside does not have same level of interest in terms of its design, historic functionality or group interest. The pillbox at Brookside is of clear local interest as a relatively rare two-storey example which acts as a reminder of the impact of the Second World War on this area and for its historic association with the now demolished munitions factory, and it is appropriately recognised on Hillingdon Council’s Local List. However, as a variation of a standard pillbox type which is now a largely isolated defensive structure, and in comparison to other listed examples, it does not demonstrate sufficient levels of structural or historic interest to merit listing in a national context. CONCLUSION After examining all the records and other relevant information and having carefully considered the architectural and historic interest of this case, the criteria for listing are not fulfilled. The pillbox in Brookside, Yeading, Hillingdon is not recommended for listing. REASONS FOR DESIGNATION DECISION The two-storey pillbox at Brookside, Yeading, Hillingdon is not recommended for listing for the following principal reasons: Level of architectural interest: * it is recognised that this is a relatively rare example of a two-storey pillbox; however, it does not compare well with other nationally listed examples which have greater group value or structural interest. Level of historic interest: * although its original function, defending an important factory which contributed to the Second World War effort affords it clear local interest, it is now a largely isolated defensive structure and the associated military structures which formerly defended the now-demolished munitions factory have been lost. Countersigning comments: Agreed. This pillbox has lost its historic context and although it is unusual for having two storeys, it does not have the degree of structural interest to be listed in the national context. SG 7 May 2020
     
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  10. ARPCDHG

    ARPCDHG Member

    I'm afraid this is Historic England all over - a national disgrace to WW2 heritage. Over the years so many sites have been destroyed because HE won't lift a finger - and they're supposed to be custodians of history. I think you also revealed the real motive - housebuilding/housebuilders. Bloody outrageous. Well done for trying anyway.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2020
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  11. Red Goblin

    Red Goblin Senior Member

    Hear, hear though I'm most reminded of the "already got one" bit in Monty Python and the Holy Grail (scene 9) not far off mocking HE's sheer jobsworth 'tick box' absurdity.

    But also note how the suspiciously-insular HHLHS seems to have queered Clive's pitch with their local listing. If their timid approach hoped to secure the greater goal via the lesser one, then they clearly failed to allow for the duck-shoving dark side of human nature tending to
    empower the almighty Law of Universal Cussedness !

    Edit - added 3rd 'H' to correct 2nd acronym.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2020
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  12. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    For info

    Listing was rejected at the last update I appealed(twice)

    "This pillbox has lost its historic context and although it is unusual for having two storeys, it does not have the degree of structural interest to be listed in the national context. SG 7 May 2020"

    I have again chased up the local council and dept for digital culture media and sport for a reply on the status of this structure.
    I assume it has now been bull dozed
     
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  13. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Last edited: May 20, 2021
  14. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    I have emailed Peabody estates who own the site the pillbox is on

    I enquired if there were plans to remove it. They do not currently have an answer but the query has been forwarded to their department that deals with historical and listed properties
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2021
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