Which Survey Regiments served in North Africa 1940 - 1942? I have pinpointed the 4th (Durham) but can not find any others. Does anyone have a M.E.W.E for a survey regiment of this era? The only one I could find on-line was dated 1944. Thanks in advance, David.
The information you need is in "Larkhill's wartime locators" by Massimo Manglilli-Climpson. Simply 4th Survey Regiment and 6th Survey Troop provided survey for operations in Eritrea, the western Desert and Greece. 1st Australian Survey Regiment and 35 NZ Survey Batery were also in theatre. A troop 1st Survey (and elements of 4th Survey ) supported Paiforce (Iraq and Persia). 5th Survey Regiment landed with the 1st Army in Op Torch. The Establishments changed and sometime in 41-42 4th adopted a modified WE which left them overstrength.
David, I only have the last couple of WEs for the Survey Regt myself (III/13/8+13/9). There were quite a few issues made it seems and I'm not sure the National Archives have the full set. Probably the ones that would be relevant for the desert war would be; III/1931/13/6 (WO24/938 p768) circa Jul-Dec40 III/13/7 (WO24/945 p1130) circa Oct-Dec42 I was pretty certain there was a Middle East table published for the Svy Regt, but I can't spot it in the indices now. If there was you'd probably need 13/7 to make sense of it, as regrettably the ME series stopped doing the Organization Table section of their WEs very early on, which takes away a lot of the detail (Motor Bns in particular being so denuded). Might be worth asking Aixman if he has a copy of the above, and likewise a ME issue. Gary
I've just stumbled across this....http://www.defencesurveyors.org.uk/Historical/WWII/Z_Location_Survey_in_War.pdf very excited!
Hi Guys, I'm new to the forum, my particular interest is the 1st Survey Regiment which my father served in. Technically the 1st Survey regiment was in North Africa in 1942 , though this is pretty tenuous as it was right at the end of 1942 and only in Egypt, briefly. The regiment spent most of the time in the middle east, mainly Syria and Jordan. They arrived in Aden on 19th November 1942 and left from there for Bombay on 9th September 1944. As far as I can ascertain they did not see any action in this time. That came when they got to Burma Andrew
Afternoon All. Just found your post regarding the 1st Survey Regiment, I am also looking into my late fathers war movements from the day he enlisted in November 1941 until he was demobbed in November 1947. He was attached to the 1st Survey on the 24th of Feb 1944, after being shipped out via Liverpool from the 188th field Regiment based in Kent. It would appear that my Father also arrived in Aden on the 5th of September and embarked on ship "M772" which sailed on the 9th / 10th heading for Bombay, arriving on the 20th (Alexandra Dock). Been in touch with the Royal Artillery regarding further information on the movements and jobs done by the unit, but have no information as the files are in deep storage because they are moving to a new museum at Salisbury, which will be open in April 2022. Jon
Presume you have his service records If you are looking to see exactly where he went then you will probably need the regiments War Diaries from TNA, - doing a search for his regiment the results are : Search results: 1 survey regiment royal artillery | The National Archives Even with covid 19 I would check out TNA website as they may be doing deals etc TD
Afternoon Tricky Dicky. Yes have his service records thanks to Drew5233 doing the research last year. Just trying to fill in the gaps and noticed that Andrew Gerrard Dad is looking into the Regiment and could have been on the same boat leaving Aden. Jon
Hi Jon, 1st Survey shipped out from the UK on 28/8/42 and travelled to Aden via South Africa arriving in Aden on 19/11/42. They spent time in Egypt and Syria mainly until departing for India from Aden in September '44. Your dad must have joined up with them just in time to leave for India. The dates I have for departure are slightly different but I don't think they al left on the same ship. The date of arrival in Bombay is the same though. The Regiment's movements from then until the return to the UK are as follows. From Place To 20/9/44 Bombay 21/9/44 25/9/44 Ranchi 28/11/44 29/11/44 Calcutta 20/12/44 22/12/44 Ranchi 8/2/45 9/2/45 Calcutta 18/2/45 20/2/45 Imphal 22/2/45 3/3/45 Pagan (Nyangu) 5/3/45 26/4/45 Nagwe 30/4/45 30/4/45 Toungu 8/5/45 8/5/45 Alemyo 31/5/45 2/6/45 Meiktila 7/6/45 8/6/45 Shan States 8/7/45 8/7/45 Kalaw Magwe 24/7/45 24/7/45 Toungowingy 18/8/45 24/8/45 Pegu 31/8/45 2/9/45 Meiktila 6/12/45 8/12/45 Rangoon 16/12/45 12/12/45 Sailed for England 13/1/46 Arrived Liverpool These dates are taken from the Memoir of the 1st Survey Regiment RA which is a series of recollections of the members of the Regiment. You will note that the dates are not entirely consistent but I have copied them exactly are written. No doubt the official war diaries would give the information with more precision but this seems to be a reasonable timeline. I am currently working my way through Massimo Mangilli-Climpson's book Larkhill's Wartime Locators which is a history of the Survey Regiments during the war. It is a bit of a chore to read and probably only of interest to those of us with a special interest in the survey regiments but you may find it interesting.
Evening Andrew. Thanks for the information on the movement of the 1st Survey Regiment around the time the unit moved from Middle East to the India / Burma. I know from the war diaries that a small detail was left behind to drive all the equipment needed back to the unit in India and arrived around the same time in Bombay. I was looking to purchase the book " Larkhill's Wartime Locators" to see if there was any further information about the unit, does it contain dates when the unit was in India / Burma and would you recommend it. After checking my Dad 's B103 part 2, he arrived in the Middle East (Suez) on the 31st of January 1944, then moved on to Cario, Beirut and Palestine. Looks like the unit was in training with other units in the area ready for a move to Burma and a war against the Japanese. Your dates regarding India and then Burma on the 24th of February 1945 arriving at Tamu are spot on with war diaries. The only difference is that my Dad stayed on after everyone went home via Rangoon around mid December. He was transferred on the 30th of December to the Chaplins Dept, HQ North Burma area where he was a driver for a Canadian Chaplin until he was sent home in August 1946. Jon
Hi Jon, Your Dad didn't miss much before he joined the Regiment in January '44. My Dad joined in April '40 at Larkhall after basic training and trained in the UK until the Regiment shipped out in August '42. They left from Gourock which is next to where my Dad lived. From there until they left for India the dates and locations are as follows From Place To 24/8/42 Gourock 28/8/42 9/9/42 Freetown 13/9/42 29/9/42 Durban 7/11/42 12/11/42 Madagascar 13/11/42 19/11/42 Aden 19/11/42 21/11/42 Suez 22/11/42 23/11/42 El Tahag (Egypt) 10/1/43 18/1/43 Baghdad 22/1/43 22/1/43 Kermanshah 25/1/43 28/1/43 Solumen Beg 18/4/43 19/4/43 Baghdad 21/4/43 24/4/43 Damascus 26/4/43 26/4/43 Homms 13/6/43 18/6/43 Haraster 6/10/43 6/10/43 Isdup (Palestine) 15/12/43 15/12/43 Haraster 17/1/44 20/1/44 Attacqua 14/3/44 15/3/44 Gedera 4/9/44 5/9/44 Suez 11/9/44 14/9/44 Aden And then to Bombay as per my previous list. Not all the regiment went to all the places. You will see that they spent a lot of time training and travelling but really did not see any action until they got to Burma. I did wonder about your Dad's late discharge. My Dad was seconded to the Garrison Engineer's office, going back to his old job as a Quantity Surveyor to work on the re building of Meiktila and was discharged in July 1946. Regarding the book by Massimo Mangilli Climpson I would say that if you are interested in your father's wartime experiences then it is worthwhile. The Author is, I presume, the son of Bill Climpson who was an officer in the 3rd Survey, so he had a personal interest. It is a long book and very detailed, its sources are of course the War diaries, but much is taken from personal papers and articles written by members of the survey regiments. There are therefore many anecdotes and personal stories and these are interesting. As a war history it is exclusively from the standpoint of the survey regiments so campaigns are covered but it is only as background. It covers the whole war service of all the survey regiments so dealing with the 1st Survey is mainly restricted to one chapter although the chapters are long so it is about 9% of the book. I have searched the name Shailer but there is no specific mention. There are also a lot of appendices and notes, I don't think it is that well written and it seems to assume a level of understanding of flash spotting and sound ranging that the general reader would not have. It is certainly not for the general reader but for those of us with a particular interest it is the only book that covers the survey regiments in any detail. It is quite pricy, not unreasonable given the low volume. I economised with the Kindle version which was £25 and has the benefit of being searchable. The print copy is £45. Hope you find this helpful Andrew
Hi Andrew My Dad took a different route, joined on his 18th birthday much to his Mother's worry, but pride as her other son had joined up at the start of the war as a M.P. First Regiment was the Royal East Kent (The Buffs) at Canterbury for basic training. After a year moving around Kent, he was then transferred to the 188th Field Regiment, Royal Artillery based at Whitstable, training on the 25 pounder and passed his " Layer" badge in December 1943, he did tell me later in his life that he was a Number 3, on the 25 pounder. In late December he was again transferred to Royal Artillery Depot and was embarked by ship via Liverpool to the Middle East, Suez. On the 22nd of February he and 11 other gunners / signals where attached to the 1st Survey Regiment at Ataka, soon after moving to Palestine. And as they say the rest is history. Regarding the book, looks like I need to purchase it to get a better feel about the Survey Regiments. Thanks for the advise. Jon
