To our Veterans..."The Third Man Factor"

Described as..."That people on the very edge of death experience a sense of an incorporeal being beside them who encourages them to make one more final effort to survive."

Tom, Niccar, Ron, Nevil, Gerry, Sapper, Tonym, and our other Veterans:
Any stories that you might care to share about the 'Third Man Factor' either first hand or from a fellow soldier?

Cheers

 

Never had a third man happened to me - I saw my parents and my then wife stood infront of me smiling on a sunny day. It was pitch black at the time.

I can remember it quite clearly and its the only time in my life I've had a proper word with the big fella upstairs.

 

Andy,
What were the circumstances...Iraq, Bosnia?

 

17thDYRCH

I re-iterate that I was one the lucky buggers that came away unharmed, in physical terms, from my wartime experiences.

You must wait to hear from those other veterans who were wounded, to learn whether or not they felt another presence at a time when they surely could not have banked on surviving their "day of trial".

If you were to widen your enquiry to include the question "Did you ever wonder if you were going to survive the war" then I would have to truthfully answer "not very often" as my sole endeavour, at all times, was in staying alive to see the ultimate victory

Ron

 

Andy,
What were the circumstances...Iraq, Bosnia?

Iraq - I'm still waiting for someone to write a book so I can find out what happened that night-The duty rumour was the Iraqi's were breaking out of Basrah to re-take the airport. All I know is there was a rather large battle and I became a believer for a couple hours.

 

Randy
Whilest lying wounded for more than ten hours near my burning Churchill Tank on Coriano Ridge in September of 1944....and tending to my gunner - I wasn't too worried about the outcome as I have a deep Catholic Faith and if I was to die to-day - then so be it. I made ready....

At some point in the late afternoon on looking at some AA shell bursts - I saw a vision of my Mother - for a few seconds - this vision was followed by another Mother and I then realised that everything was going to be OK as I was being looked after....

Two years later .....on my first Home leave -my Father took me outside into the garden and told me that on same night they were both asleep when my Mother sat up in bed - wakened my Father - and said " something has happened to Thomas....."

A few days later a telegram arrived indicating that I was "missing believed wounded" - my Mother never talked about this to her dying day.....

To those people who do not believe - or have rejected the "BIG FELLA" I can only offer to them - Google - "Akita- Japan 1973...."

Then think about it ...
Cheers

 

NO, nothing during both times I was wounded.... But during the time I suffered multiple pulmonary Embolisms. (Arising from my lower limb war injuries) Near the point of death. I did have a very deep and quite incredible near death experience.

It affected me deeply, and I found the experience so profoundly beautiful, that I have never been able to describe that moment. It is far and away beyond the terms of beauty ...goodness ... The outcome? I do not fear death, for although the experience many well be a chemical reaction in the brain. It is something quite extraordinary and unforgettable.. And I do not believe in Fairies!! Or Pixies or Ghosts!
Sapper

 

Iraq - I'm still waiting for someone to write a book so I can find out what happened that night-The duty rumour was the Iraqi's were breaking out of Basrah to re-take the airport. All I know is there was a rather large battle and I became a believer for a couple hours.


Andy,
I imagine the memories of that night are still clear and vivid. Thanks for sharing.

Randy

 

Randy
Whilest lying wounded for more than ten hours near my burning Churchill Tank on Coriano Ridge in September of 1944....and tending to my gunner - I wasn't too worried about the outcome as I have a deep Catholic Faith and if I was to die to-day - then so be it. I made ready....

At some point in the late afternoon on looking at some AA shell bursts - I saw a vision of my Mother - for a few seconds - this vision was followed by another Mother and I then realised that everything was going to be OK as I was being looked after....

Two years later .....on my first Home leave -my Father took me outside into the garden and told me that on same night they were both asleep when my Mother sat up in bed - wakened my Father - and said " something has happened to Thomas....."

A few days later a telegram arrived indicating that I was "missing believed wounded" - my Mother never talked about this to her dying day.....

To those people who do not believe - or have rejected the "BIG FELLA" I can only offer to them - Google - "Akita- Japan 1973...."

Then think about it ...
Cheers

Tom,
One is always amazed at what happens under extreme stress. An incredible story.

Cheers
Randy

 

Sapper,
I suppose words alone would not be able to express what you went through. Many others have experienced the opening of something that cannot be described only to 'fall back ' to life and reality.

Cheers

 

In his book, With the Old Breed, E.B. Sledge describes being in combat with the Marines on Peleliu. At one point in the campaign he heard a loud, distinct voice say to him, "You will survive the war!" None of the men sitting with him heard a thing.

 

Ghosts Have Warm Hands

Will Bird wrote extensively about this type of experience.

Will R Bird - Ghosts

 

Pulmonary Embolism are nearly always fatal. That what it says in the book!
In This case,

I experienced the near death experience where I was in total blackness and in front of me was a door ..Just ajar. Around the door came a golden light something so full of beauty, but most of all "Goodness" I have never been able to describe something so beautiful, or the feeling that emanates around that door.

That was accompanied by low and expectant voices. familiar but not recognised voices. As though there was a gathering there ready to greet me.........

That feeling is quite beyond my feeble attempts to describe, for it was something unimaginably wonderful.

had I opened that door? I am convinced that I would have died. But I did not. For a long time after and even today the wonder of that moment has stayed with me.

Within a week, I had recovered the huge blood clot in my left lung had vanished... I asked the Specialist "where is it gone?" and he told me He just did not know.
Blood clots always leave scars!

I have been on anticoagulant, warfarin for 39 years. I am not a religious man. A bit of an agnostic!. But that moment? a miraculous moment of great wonder.....
A chemical reaction in the brain in certain circumstances? Of a privileged, but very brief glimpse of something else? I do not know......There you have it... a very personal thing not much talked about.

 

Brian,
Great stuff.
At my young age of 30 years junior to your mate Thomas Canning, I am not looking for any golden light...just yet.

cheers from the colony, just a wee east of Aziz,BC.

 

Sapper, thanks for sharing that very personal moment.
Thankfully I have never been in a near death moment (yet!) and despite being raised RC I am not religious either. But I feel somehow perhaps an experience like that at such a critical moment could be either a 'moment of choice' or something of a comfort and certainly something to ponder on later.

 

Canuck
As a kid of thirteen or so, I remember climbing a fence near a quarry. It was late at night. Visibilty was zero. Once over the fence...I absolutely froze. I took a quick glance forward...and realized that had I gone 2 more steps, I would have fallen to a rather early expiration date. Maybe the "third man factor" saved me from the golden light.

Cheers from a land where no sane individual will vote for the party led by Taliban Jack.

 

Mike -
every day we have a choice but not everyone has the real reason to make that choice and time goes by until there is no longer a choice but judgement - it was Teilhard de Chardin - the Jesuit Archeologist(Piltdown - Peking and Java man) and Philosopher who claimed that there was no Hell - until met by an irrifutable arguement - wherupon he then said that God was too merciful to send anyone there - yeah right- as to-day the common wisdom is that everyone goes to heaven -no matter what you do or don't believe..... yeah right again ....
Cheers

 

Hi Tom my old mate! Sheila sends her love....

Now! This old buzzard is a lifetime engineer. Very much down to earth, where a spade is a spade Not a bloody shovel!

But I am very interested in the structure of the universe, and of us. For what ever you look at on this planet, everything is put together perfectly.
,
From the finest flower seed as small as dust, to the universe itself, is a work of wonder.
Just the flower seed has all the information inside that tells its clock when spring has arrived, When to put put roots and form flowers. Even to sexuak desire in wanting to produce young....Immense amounts of information contained in a minute particle.

Everywhere you look you find perfection... It does seem to me that it is only when you grow old, that you realize what a gem this earth is. And what a great privilege it is to have been allowed to enjoy it.
That is one reason why I am so bloody determined not to fall off my twig..Just Yet!
sapper

 

Not too many takers of Pascal's Wager in this thread, I see. You'll have the time to be sorry, a really long time indeed!!!

... it was Teilhard de Chardin - the Jesuit Archeologist(Piltdown - Peking and Java man)

Hmm, the Piltdown man is not a very good choice to base an argument upon...

The "Piltdown Man" was the fossilised remains of a previously unknown early human, consisting of fragments of a skull and jawbone collected in 1912 from a gravel pit at Piltdown, East Sussex, England that were later discovered to be a hoax.
And where does the reverend father come into this? Here in good company:

The identity of the Piltdown forger remains unknown, but suspects have included Dawson, Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, Arthur Keith, Martin A. C. Hinton, Horace de Vere Cole and Arthur Conan Doyle[8].

Quite a brilliant man, though

 

For me the war ended on 24 April 1945 in northern Italy. Things had got pretty bad by then and for a day or two I couldn't quite believe that I had survived the war. It was a feeling that lasted less vividly for quite a few years.