Tracing my Grandad's WWII record - Joseph Henry Littledyke 1058790

Starting my own thread, instead of hijacking the 113th LAA journey through Europe thread.

Not ruling out any of the anecdotal stuff which had him pulled from D-Day landings, involved in relief of Belsen and a visit to Berlin but looking for solid evidence to corroborate the stories. Obviously, I want it all to be true!

His sole surviving son (my uncle) has done a lot of family tree research and recounts the stories of his Dad's wartime experiences. Some by word of mouth. He allegedly served in HAA and LAA regiments.
Unfortunately, I never asked my Grandad about it before he died in 1987.

He was born in 1906.
He joined the Royal Artillery in 1924 for 6 years at the age of 18.
His service number is 1058790

I've found his Attestation record on FMP



gmyles kindly found his Tracer record on Ancestry. This places him in the 626th Infantry Regiment, Royal Artillery from 1st Feb 1945. Created from redundant AA batteries to make up for manpower shortage in NW Europe. Prior to this he was in an unidentified HAA regiment.



Photo from the family archive. The claim this is in Berlin is yet to be proved.

 

Thanks to Historic Steve

626th and 628th Infantry Regiment RA were under command 306th Anti-Aircraft Infantry Brigade in Devon and moved on 4 May 45 with the brigade HQ from Okehampton to Purfleet, Kent staging the night at Yattendon, Berkshire, both regiments did not arrive with the brigade HQ in France and have yet to find out where they went, awaiting Kew documentation from Lee@arcre that hopefully will give details

Can confirm the only RA units in Berlin were 3rd & 5th Regiment Royal Horse Artillery and briefly 344 (Independent) Searchlight Battery (Moonlight)

21st Army Group later British Army of the Rhine (under construction)

 

Thanks to gmyles

626 Regt RA info here: 626 Infantry Regiment RA(TA) - The Royal Artillery 1939-45

 

On the Tracer record it says:

Y(E) List 31/5/45 (v/72

Any ideas.

My uncle says he requested Grandad's service records months ago.
Any idea how long they are taking?

I live in London. What could I gain from a visit to Kew?

 

The Y list was for soldiers who had been sick for over 21 days. They could be transferred to a holding unit waiting return to their unit, which depending on where they were might take some time.
It is noticeable that numbers of men were put on the Y list when returned to the UK possibly following a medical examination or simply classed as ineffective for one reason or another.
Not sure what E means possibly Extended.
I think that V/72 references the appertaining Regulations

I wish that I lived local to Kew, I would open a guesthouse for visitors from this Forum!

If nothing else, the experience would be well worth it.

There are lots of Londoners on the forum who could advise you on that.

Good luck in your endeavours but the Service Records are really useful for the full story of his service.
You will probably need help to transcribe them so post them on here if and when you get them.
Worth the wait.

 

There are members here who copy war diaries at Kew for a reasonable fee,however if you know what you are looking for it might be worth organising a trip to Kew
Re time to receive service records it is best if you chase them up and keep on top of the timescales

 

I wonder if the E is a medical classification.
E means Permanently Unfit.

He didn't have any disabilities I was aware of.

 

Hi My dad joined in 37 so might have known your relative. He was in Gibraltar at the start of the war I will have a look at his records and compare them with yours. I have put a letter hear that was sent to my mum from a family Basil and my dad shared food with in 44.

 

Re medical classification.
Many men became ill with disease and other debilitating illness that prevented further service due to the conditions that they were living in.
Whilst in Northwest Europe they could occasionally live in buildings, many of which were ruins, they spent a lot of time under canvas in the cold and damp and in the depth of winter, snow and ice. It took its toll on many who before the war had never left a town and the comforts of home.
Whilst many think of the conditions in the jungles of Burma, Italy wasn't much better up in the mountains carrying their supplies on Mules who slid to their deaths from mountain paths in rain, sleet, ice and snow. Winter 1944 was particularly bad in Norther Western Europe, (as the Band of Brothers films constantly reminded us during the Battle of the Bulge).
Even after hostilities ended men were dying with Influenza or Tuberculosis in the crowded accommodation of the ruined towns and cities of Europe.

The Service Records however will not reveal his Medical Records as they are confidential for 100 years.

 

626 Infantry regiment was in 307 Infantry Brigade Jan-Mar '45
During that time it was in the U.K.

Mar-May '45 the 626th was in 306 Infantry Brigade.

8th May the 306 Infantry Brigade was Line of Communication with 21 Army Group in NW Europe, prior to that they were in the U.K.

Grandad on Y list at 31st May 1945. Presumably he was Ill from 10th May or earlier.

Unlikely to have left the U.K.between joining the 626th on 1st Feb and being deemed unfit at the end of May. Can't see how the Belsen story fits.

Finally demobbed October '45. Would have been deployed in NW Europe between June and October?

 

Or is the Y list date the START of his 3+ weeks?

In which case he's probably had enough time to somehow get to Belsen.

 

It took me some time to find out what my uncles did in the war even with their Service Records.
There are no shortcuts.
There were no Tracer Cards on Geneo sites, they are largely a red herring, showing very little detail.

Service Record is the way to go if you are prepared to pay for a Death Cert to prove he is deceased and pay the fee to the MOD all in all, about forty Quid.
There might be a long wait but unless you are very unlucky, you will know when, where and what he did.
All in Army Jargon because it is in effect what he was paid from. No Battles just pay codes. postings and course dates.
No guarantees though.
It might look like a puzzle but people on here can help you if you let them see the necessary pages.
These people who advise you do it for nothing as a bit of a hobby.

It's entirely up to you.

 

Thanks. I will be applying for his service record.
Uncle has already applied but I will too. He's getting on a bit.

Shouldn't need the death certificate because he was born 116 years ago.

Just need to find a cheque book!

 

Applied for his service record. managed to do it online.

Bought 'Gunners in Normandy' book which is fascinating and very detailed. Covers Jan '42 to August '44
The training, organisation and logistics is mind blowing.

 

My uncle finally received my Grandad's service record. Took over a year to get it.

Spent majority of the war in the U.K.

113th AA (presume HAA) 17/3/42
439 (Independent) HAA Battery 3/10/42
Spent a month in hospital Feb 1943 with face and shoulder injury.
Returned to 439 Bty
626th Regt RA from 1/2/45
He was posted to NWE from 6/5/45 to 31/8/45 - Qualified for the France/Germany Star by 2 days!
Y Listed and returned home - Nothing on his casualty record about this.

I plan to have a look at the 626th Regt war diaries unless someone already has them.
I think the relevant diaries are WO 166/16917 (March '45) and WO 171/5069 (Feb, April-Sept '45)

Can't find anything about the first 3 postings
205th HAA?
9th Res AA Regt?
15th HAA?

439 Battery, originally under 113th HAA is 'Independent' - How can I find out more about this?

 

So I've found this interesting info about 439 Bty.
They were involved in Operation Diver - shooting down flying bombs.

It is a listed historic site, a Scheduled Monument.

Heavy Anti-aircraft gunsite 350m north east of Little Oakley Hall, Little Oakley - 1019486 | Historic England

You can see the remains of two gun emplacements.

Google Maps

 

205 AA Training Rgt was at Aborfield, Berkshire. In July 1941 it re-organised as a mixed (i.e. ATS) training regt and changed again in May 43 as a mobile training regt.
Sorry no info on the other 2 - 9 Reserve AA Regiment & 15 HAA Practice Camp.

439's Diver site H5 is shown on my Gun Defended Area map for Harwich. The site is at the bottom of the map just below Ramsey.

 

Thanks Derek, that's very helpful.

He spent two years with the 205 Training Regiment. Does that mean he could have been an instructor?

He got promoted twice in 1941 whilst there, going from Gnr to Bdr. He had been a Regular in the RA 1924-1930, a reservist 1930-1936, then re-engaged in 1936 for another 6 years. I presume he would have already been trained on up to date weapons at the time? Or am I over thinking it?

 

He must have been on the staff of 205 Trg Rgt to have been there that long but in what capacity we don't know. He could have been in an admin post (storeman etc) or an instructor. My own father became a L/Bdr driving instructor after his 6 weeks basic training because he could drive heavy vehicles.
Given his pre & early war service his training would have been up to date.

 

Off to the National Archives this morning. First time visit. Relevant diaries have been ordered.