What If Germany As Won In Russia?

oh, now i see what The West is, and what it's up to!

 

I disagree. I think that Germany could have won the war because it would have had Russias factories and natural resources to continoue its war machine. Plus there would only be 2 fronts and Germany would have a large supply of oil and could link up with the Japanese if needed. Also the divisions that fought in Russia would be so well experienced that they would have quickly whiped out the brand new recruits at Normandy (Though some fought in North Africa). Also I think after the Russian front was secure they could send aid to the Italians and take the Suez canal eventaully leading to a 1 front war.

 

One of the key elements involved in stopping the German advance into Russia was the weather. Hitler delayed the start of "Barbarossa". The campaign was slowed by autumnal rains,and winter came early. A relief programme "Winterhilfe"was launched throughout German territory, for the troops to get some winter clothing - what the Wehrmacht was doing, I don't know. Many simply froze to death..and equipment didn't work! But Russia had one other ally, it's huge continental mass.

 

Wow Need to look over this thread to make sure I won't follow this chap if some similar discussion occur (giggles).

PS: he was russian or western?

 

I believe that it was in October of 41 after the disastrous losses at Kiev and once the Germans started their final drive for Moscow that Stalin instructed Beria to see if he could get the Germans to agree to an armistice. Beria approached I believe it was the Bulgarian ambassador and asked if he could find what conditions the Germans would agree to. The Bulgarian said to him, "Even if you retreat to the Urals, you'll still win in the end." Ultimately the Bulgarian never asked the question.
Stalin raised the prospect of an armistice with the Germans again in November but Molotov told him to forget it.
IMO that was probably as close as the Germans ever came to winning in the east. If the Bulgarian had asked the question perhaps history would have taken a different course.

 

A rave from the grave.
'Stalin' was such fun, almost a shame he was deleted way back so newer chaps can't search his posts and get some context .

As for 'Gestapo', he was, as is obvious, a liar, and I now know who he really was .

~A

Reading back through this thread, I'm surprised you did not mention that ineffably turgid Jimbotosome

 

Don't be ridiculous. You are so uninformed it is ridiculous. 5 times more people would have been killed by carpet bombing of the entire country of Japan.

The shock of the devastating power eventually led to surrender and saved millions of lives.

Get your head out of your back pocket and study real history not what is the easiest to believe.

Wow Geoff, you really hammered-down on him! I don't think I have ever seen such an Owen-esque comment like that from you.
A rave from the grave.
'Stalin' was such fun, almost a shame he was deleted way back so newer chaps can't search his posts and get some context .

As for 'Gestapo', he was, as is obvious, a liar, and I now know who he really was .

~A
And you are going to have to tell me.

Reading back through this thread, I'm surprised you did not mention that ineffably turgid Jimbotosome

Wow. Two ten dollar words in one sentence. Where did you learn English?

 

Reading back through this thread, I'm surprised you did not mention that ineffably turgid Jimbotosome

Jimbo was okay! He just did not like the Russians.

 

Wow Geoff, you really hammered-down on him! I don't think I have ever seen such an Owen-esque comment like that from you.



Have the "Classic" threads with these "Deniers of sufficient Allied Involvement" and "Accusers of Allied War Crimes" been deleted? What a shame, I was going to bring some of them to the front so the "newbies" could see the real me when I am p****d off with people who have 60 years of hindsight stuffed up their jumper and denigrate those who trod, sailed, drove and flew to help win that conflict.:icon_fork:

 

If Germany had won in Russia, the US nukes Berlin, war over!

 

Jimbo was okay! He just did not like the Russians.
Geoff, the only reason that you can say that was because Australia was probably the only country Jimbo did NOT have an axe to grind over!!! The guys had issues over everything, Russia, Tanks versus Air Power, Europeans

 

Wow. Two ten dollar words in one sentence. Where did you learn English?

British Council? :p

Jimbo was okay! He just did not like the Russians.

He was nuts! If you only said something like "The sky is blue" he'd jump at you with a long, booooooring tirade against the evils of communism, if it came on topic or not! One of the biggest permanent chips on a shoulder I ever saw in a ww2 forum. He did manage to keep me away from here for a long while (whether* that was a good thing or not is a fine subject for another thread ).


* See, Jeff? I can write "whether" as well ! :curtsey:

 

Not deleted by me Geoff, in fact I discretely bought a few back out of obscurity when I first took on admin, around about the time I unlocked all the 'controversial' threads I could think of. They're lurking out there somewhere ('Lend-lease' might be a good search term? ).
I don't ever want to go back to those circular fights again, but it has to be said it was often a hoot at the time; clouds of steam emitting from ears and the sound of knives sharpening all round with each post feeling like 'going over the top' again .
I learnt quite a lot while checking the facts on each rant & counter-rant - the levels of entertaining bile lost a fair few members though.


The ultimate answer to almost all 'what-iffery'.
Maybe we should post that on any new 'what ifs' after the now traditional righteous explosion & closure from Owen?

Edit: - Cross-posted with the above from Owen. Reputation? You mate? I couldn't possibly comment...
It should be the default answer to all threads that mention "what if",

 

Stalin is not even on the members list anymore. I couldn't find him!