Owen asked me to look into the War Diaries of this unit for a veteran. So I thought I would share them for all forum members who are interested. They are available to view and download on my Flickr account here: 2nd SLI 1944 - a set on Flickr There is a good map in the diary, below: Makes interesting comparison with the ground now on Google Earth: 43° 4'13.28"N 12° 0'3.01"E
Paul, With regards to the map and marked positions of the enemy. Would this have been made by Recce patrols? as it mentions the camouflage being so good the positions could only be observed at 20 yards. This possibly rules out the help of aerial photography I was just wondering if this was a typical Recce type plan. I remember my father saying that the German camouflage was really good and that you had to be extremely careful. Tom
It is quite possible the Divisional Recce boys were up here first as this was during the push after the attack up the Liri Valley, when things were more mobile. However, the battalion would have its own scouts section who may have gone out and done this themselves on patrol work.
Paul, Thanks for that. Whoever did the Recce made a good job looking at what was uncovered. A credit to those who took part. Regards Tom
Paul - don't know where you get the idea that there was mobility at the Liri Valley - there was a monumental traffic jam when 6th Armoured had to come back when their supplies couldn't get through - they then bumped into the 5th Canadian armoured Div - then 78th tried to squeeze past pushing the 4th Div into the ditches - then 8th Indian got tangled up with some French types on the wrong side of the Secco river- then an AGRA tried to move forward - Gen Juin was swearing that 8th Army was being ultra slow as usual - Gen Mark Clark was hoping we would stay there and allow him to be first into Rome .....any Recce mob had time to paint their maps in oils ! Cheers
Tom - I take your point about the Valley (when you visit it now you can see what a bottleneck it could be), but as I said this is after the Liri action, when things were very mobile pushing up to Rome and beyond, especially beyond Rome. The map above is a position not far from Lake Trasimeno.
Paul - I knew that .....they were so fast after Rome that they couldn't print the Maps fast enough.... the 6th Sth African Div thought they had captured Chiusi - but they had folded their maps wrongly - they were only at the station - the City was another half a mile north...it was all in fun though ! Cheers
Paul - I knew that .....they were so fast after Rome that they couldn't print the Maps fast enough.... the 6th Sth African Div thought they had captured Chiusi - but they had folded their maps wrongly - they were only at the station - the City was another half a mile north...it was all in fun though ! Cheers Great story, Tom. Good job they didn't have their maps upside down as well!
Very interesting information and map Paul ! Lake Trasimeno is not too far away from here, less than an hour drive, so if I get the chance I will go visit this place and I'll make photos to show how the area looks today. If you have any other maps or indications of this area or up towards Florence, please let me know and I can do the same. Thanks! Justin
Interesting thread going on there. My Wife's Great Grandfather was SLI during WW1 and was mortally wounded at Ypres. I certainly found it very interesting following his history and that of 7 Bn if I remember correctly. I am sure you already know, but the original diaries arekept at the HQ in Jalalabad Barracks in Taunton (or they certainly were about 5 years ago!). Based on the information I got out of the diaries, I was able to take my Mother and Father in-Law to Ypres and we not only went to his grave, but also to the spot were he was wounded. Strings
Finally got chance to go & visit said Veteran last Wednesday. Had a good chat. This is a photo of Maurice & myself, I was watching a video of the Italian campaign he'd put on to watch. Maurice (right) in Egypt before heading off to Italy. He said he was called up in 1939 to do 6 months training before being sent back to civie street & his trade as a butcher War broke out so he was kept in. He grew up in same area of Swindon as I did but was sent to the SLI. Was posted to 6 SLI a TA bn. He volunteered to join the band & learnt to play the cornet in 6 weeks. If he failed to do so he'd have been sent back to his rifle platoon. He worked his way up from 3rd Cornet to 1st Cornet. He was posted to 2 SLI post-Dunkirk. Was sent to Kent on anti-invasion duties. There is a photo in IWM of the SLI on the RHDR , which I must print off for him. He said later that 2 SLI was split , with half going to Gibralter, which is where he went next. There are also pics of 2 SLI in Gib on IWM site. From Gib they went to Eygpt before going to Italy in 1944 to take part in the fighting in the Liri Valley in the shadow of Monte Cassino. As a bandsman he acted as a stretcher bearer. He unit got rather cut up crossing the Rapido/Gari , got the map of the forum to show him where they crossed . He said there wasn't a blade of grass to be seen.The white tapes marking the lanes through the minefields where target by the German machine gunners. The folding storm boats were easy targets & he was very busy with the casualties. He survived the Liri battle. He did mention that somewhere , not sure when & where, that there was a stack of Bailey bridge parts. The local Italian kids used it as a climbing frame, unfortunately one 8 year old lad slipped of & a piece of Bailey fell on his head & chest killing him. Maurice was shot in the guts in the fighting up near Rimini he said, in September 1944. Was sent back to UK in a hospital ship, all fully lit up as per usual for a hospital ship. He spent a year in various hospitals, one at Whalley, Lancashire & also the one at Stratton , Swindon. He did say his guts were rather messed up with the gunshot wound scar & operation scar both bursting open at one stage. Pretty grim. Anyway after the war he was awarded his war pension & learnt how to be a carpenter . He spent 35 years at a local builders . His Grand-daughter recently graduated from Uni & he had his 90th birthday party earlier this year. Map from 4th Div history .
Interesting story, there, O. Am I right in thinking none of the SLI battalions were ever part of the 43rd Wessex Div? H
Interesting story, there, O. Am I right in thinking none of the SLI battalions were ever part of the 43rd Wessex Div? H H, 4 & 7 SLI were in 43rd Div. > 43rd Division 6 SLI, Maurices first unit were in the duplicate 45th Wessex Div. > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/45th_Infantry_Division_(United_Kingdom)
Owen Most interesting and I'll keep the maps for further scrutiny He said there wasn't a blade of grass to be seen. During my very first day's action with the 4th QOH we progressed rhough a wooded area. Without exception, every tree that we passed had virtually every minor branch missing and every tree trunk was completely covered in a white powder. The effect was quite ghostlike and bore no relation to the world in which I had formerly existed. Maurice's story, like so many others that tell of wounds received so many years ago that still affect their recipients, is a reminder to us all of the legacy left by WW2. If you are still in touch with Maurice please pass on my very best wishes. Thanks again. Ron
Just phoned Maurice, poor old chap sounds a bit puffed-out & having some medical problems. Hope I was able to cheer him up knowing that someone out there is thinking of him.
Had a phone call from my mum earlier. Maurice died on Tuesday. Glad I was able to speak to him last week.
