8th Armoured Brigade HQ

Discussion in 'RAC & RTR' started by Benno, Nov 21, 2018.

  1. Benno

    Benno Member

    According to my Grandad's (J.G Bennett - 7952562) service record he spent the majority of his time in WW2 posted to "8th Armoured Brigade HQ" unit as a Trooper and then a W Cpl after being sent home wounded from France following D Day.
    After visiting the archive at Bovington and having help decipher the service record they advised that he would have been a "Clerk" as his trade on enlistment was "Clerk".
    Although he didn't talk much about his experience none of the family believed he was a Clerk.

    If any body can help us understand more what this unit did it and what his experiences may have been it would be much appreciated.
  2. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    8 Armoured Brigade: HQ | The National Archives
    Reference: WO 169/8872
    8 Armoured Brigade: HQ
    Date: 1943 Jan.- Dec.
    Held by: The National Archives, Kew

    HQ | The National Archives
    Reference: WO 171/613
    Date: 1944 Jan-Dec
    Held by: The National Archives, Kew

    H.Q. | The National Archives
    Reference: WO 171/4327
    Date: 1945 Jan.- Dec.
    Held by: The National Archives, Kew

    Dont take this the wrong way but there was another thread for someones Dad recently who said he was in certain units and certain places, when we looked into it he was a driver in North Africa and NW Europe, this was at odds to what the family had been told.

    Others who can decipher records better than I should be along to detail things better

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  3. Benno

    Benno Member

    Cheers Tricky, I'm quite open to him being a Clerk, my Dad felt a bit insulted when I told him but now is just interested to find out more.
  4. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    My Dad was a signaller in a Brigade HQ, but they all did their job, not matter what that was. They did what was asked of them

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  5. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    He may well have been a clerk on enlistment, that should be confirmed on his records, and the army had clerks at HQs and in the field throughout the war. It doesn't necessarily mean however that he remained a clerk throughout his service. My father was an Invoice Clerk on enlistment in 1940 but went on the be a sergeant at the front line for the rest of the war.

    Your grandfather was Wounded In Action on 1.8.44 in North West Europe and came back to the UK, he appears in the army casualty lists for that period. He had other periods in hospital as indicated.

    Looks like he didn't join 8 Armoured Bde until 29/10/1943 but he went to Egypt on 31/12/1942.

    Recommend that you make out a timeline based on the information on all the forms in his records plus that received from Bovington and, as post #2 mentions get the diaries for the relevant units at the relevant time.
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2018
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  6. Benno

    Benno Member

    Already attempted a timeline as follows

    Joined / Enlisted 22/1/1942
    Date called to Colours – 12/3/1942
    Taken on Strength (TOS) Middle East – Egypt – 31/12/1942 – Trooper
    8th Armoured Brigade HQ – 29/10/1943 - Trooper
    Struck off Strength (SOS) – 18/11/1943 – Embarked ME
    Disembarked to UK – 11/12/1943 - Awarded African Star
    Taken on Strength (TOS) 8th Armoured Brigade HQ – 12/4/1944 - Trooper
    Paid Acting Corporal – 13/5/1944
    Embarked UK for North West Europe 2/6/1944
    Disembarked North West Europe 6/6/1944
    Wounded in action 1/8/1944
    Disembarked UK 5/8/1944
    War Corporal 11/8/1944 (rank given for duration of hostilities)
    Royal Armoured Corps Depot 14/9/1944
    152nd Regiment 16/2/1945
    Awarded 1939-45 and France and Germany Stars 28/12/1945
    59th Training Regiment 30/3/1946
    Released 24/8/1946 after serving for 4 years 7 months 2 days
  7. Benno

    Benno Member

    Absolutely, he was a lovely man and I am very proud of him and wish I had talked to him more about his experiences
  8. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY


    In ref. to "If any body can help us understand more what this unit did it and what his experiences may have been it would be much appreciated"

    Do you already know much about "8th Armoured Brigade HQ" or what army clerks did variously during WW2?

    As a quick reference to the 8th Armoured have you, for instance, glanced through: The 8TH ARMOURED BRIGADE

    There are a few mentions of the "8th Armoured Brigade HQ" in there.

    As regards the role of British "army clerks" during ww2 - I'm not sure if there is a specific thread on this yet, although a glance at the subject suggests there are lots of possibilities.

    Any idea re. the names of any of his officers? These officers names might also help to provide some clues.

    Incidentally, reading the record in post #1 - I think it does say disembarked NWE 6/6/44


    Has: "On the next day (7/6/44) the bridgehead was enlarged, St Leger was captured and the Sherwood Rangers Yeomanry entered Bayeux receiving a tremendous ovation from the liberated town. The 24th Lancers landed during the day as did the leading equipment of Main Brigade H.Q."

    Parts of the 24th L did also land on 6/6/44
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  9. Benno

    Benno Member

    Ramiles thanks for your post. I have read a number of books and articles on the 8th armed bde which have mentioned the HQ and I've also seen there formation details and the D day landing tables which gives a variety of vehicles and roles within the squadron.
    I haven't really been able to determine their role compared to the fighting squadrons such as the Sherwood Rangers and the Lancers.
    With regard the Clerk question I can only guess at their role but I would also like to find out if my Grandad actually did this role as the only mention of it in his service record is his role before enlistment, there is no other mention of it or any other role in his record.
  10. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    Thanks Benno,

    Re. "officers" - my example here has "Luddington" and "Arbuthnot" and by researching these names I was able to make progress etc. So can you see any such names in your own grandfather's records? i.e. that might indicate who he may have been "working with" etc.

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  11. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Can any one enlighten me as to what is meant by 152 Regt ??

    Re HQ personnel - they would need to keep all the admin of the Brigade working, from replacement vehicles to ammunition to repacement men to updating service records . On many occassions they would if the enemy overran or infiltrated past the front line troops act as infantry etc to hold their position, often with the enemy coming from various directions.
    I would offer that it will be very difficult to tie down what your Grandfather actually did - different matter if he was an Officer as all their movements were recorded by the HQ clerks - but being an NCO I feel unless someone has written their own memoirs of either HQ or 8th Armoured Bde HQ systems/clerking then from official records finding out what he actually did on a day to day or week by week basis will be exceptionally difficult.

    The link below is one I have found for an Infantry Brigade so it needs some adjusting for an Amoured Bde obviously, but does show Clerks and their location within the 'system'
    WWII British Inf Brigade HQ Staffing Levels?


    Perhaps uploading the documents in full might help understand them in context
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  12. Benno

    Benno Member

    3B James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg 2A James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg 5B James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg 1A James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg 2B James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg 4B James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg 1B James Grant Bennett 7952562.jpg
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  13. Benno

    Benno Member

    Grandad WW2.jpg

    James Grant Bennett (Grandad) on far left
  14. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic

    152 Regiment Royal Armoured Corps was raised from the 11th Battalion Kings (Liverpool) Regiment when a number of Infantry Battalions were converted to RAC in about 1942-3
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  15. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member


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  16. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

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  17. Benno

    Benno Member

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  18. SDP

    SDP Incurable Cometoholic

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  19. Benno

    Benno Member

  20. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member


    There may be some publications/books you ?need?

    World War Two
    The 8th Armoured Brigade 1939 - 1945
    Hannover, 1946, Card Covers. First Edition. 43pp,
    £35 + £2.00 P&P A very rare publication in this condition, and about the cheapest on the net.
    Two folding maps-Europe & N.Africa-Middle East, wounded/lilled stats
    Probably a unit printers
    Div. emblems on pages
    internally very clean

    or perhaps
    Monty's Marauders: Red Fox 8th Armoured Brigade
    Delaforce, Patrick

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