British Armoured Car Regiments markings, Italy 1944

Discussion in 'Vehicle Names and Census Numbers' started by niccolo24, May 12, 2020.

  1. niccolo24

    niccolo24 Member

    I am looking for some information about Armoured Car Regiments in Italy in 1944. Specifically, I am looking for pictures of vehicles from 1st King Dragoon Guards, 12th Lancers, 27th Lancers and 1st Household Cavalry regiments. I trying to figure out with markings the vehicles of those units had.
    Theoretically, being Corps-level units, they should have had the green and blue AoS with the number 44 and a top white bar, and the corps insignia, but I am coming across contrasting information. For example, in the case of 1st King Dragoons Guards, it is not impossible that their armoured cars and vehicles showed the regimental insignia instead as shown by this plate from Concord’s book British Armor in Sicily and Italy

    And by this picture of uncertain date and location: 1st kdg daimler.jpg

    In this case the Staghound seems to be showing the simultaneous use of both the regimental and corps symbol (picture not taken in italy):

    For what concerns the 12th lancers, I have only been able to find a fairly grainy picture of their Daimler AC, but there is no visible insignia:
    12th Royal Lancers (Prince of Wales's) po, italy, 1944.jpg

    There are various images of m3 halftracks of 27th lancers, and Concord’s book states that tac signs of independent Armoured Regiments (including, I suppose, Armoured Car Regiments), were probably in red:
    27th lancers.JPG

    Again though, no corps or regimental insignia nor AoS is visible.
    In the case of Household cavalry regiment, I have never seen a single picture of the vehicles of the regiment.
    Is there anybody who has more photographs of those units, or can shed any light about markings of their vehicles?
    Thank you, best regards
  2. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    Hi again Niccolo,

    This photo has a somewhat contradictory reverse caption (but if it was actually 7 Armoured Div it would have a jerboa!) but the AoS marking does show the emblem for a X Corps unit according to my copy of Warpaint. Those books don't have a table for corps units in Italy so I am unclear whether there were changes but perhaps 63 was used in Italy for Corps armoured car regiments.


    All the other photos don't really provide evidence for a lack of AoS marking because they don't show the entire or rear and in most cases show neither.
    niccolo24 likes this.
  3. niccolo24

    niccolo24 Member

    hello, indeed I have seen this picture before with some uncertainty about the attribution, it adds to the mystery....
    Chris C likes this.
  4. niccolo24

    niccolo24 Member

    Going through the collections of the IWM I have found a partial answer, at least to the KDG question:
    1st kdg trani 1943.jpg
    1st kdg trani 1943 2.jpg

    Those are two Daimler ACs of the KDG in Trani, september 1943. While the AoS is not visible, the regimental insigna clearly is.
    Tom OBrien likes this.
  5. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    NA 7331 is the original of the second image you posted.

    There are definitely a lot of cases in the desert in which armoured vehicles didn't sport their AoS.
  6. niccolo24

    niccolo24 Member

    From IWM, a few more pictures of 12th Lancers, in Austria in 1945 with a very odd AoS sign, a 76 in a single-colour square with an additional dark small square in the right upper corner with a further number. No Corps insigna, but maybe a pennant painted on the sides, in red over white. The vehicles are named. 12th lancers austria 1945 2.JPG

    12th lancers austria 1945.JPG

    and a line of 27th Lancers Staghounds, no visible insigna apart from the same pennant, painted on the turret:
    27th lancres, austria, 08-1945.jpg
  7. Gil Wilner

    Gil Wilner Member

    The "odd AoS is for Royal Artillery, which had a blue square with one corner in red. In the above case the upoer right is for the 1st battery. Also the 76 number was used by the Royal Field Artillery.
    I don't know if the 12th Lancers were, as Army troop attached or under command of artillery units
    niccolo24 likes this.
  8. Those are Not KDG, but 1st Royal Dragoons A squadron. Trani is on east coast of Italy where Royals operated, KDG landed on Salerno that is west coast of Italy. Marking is Royals, not KDG!

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