British Unit, Market Garden 20 september ID

Discussion in 'NW Europe' started by FrankTheTank, Jul 26, 2018.

  1. FrankTheTank

    FrankTheTank New Member

    Hello everyone,

    I'm trying to ID a specific Sherman tank and its riders. (See pictures).
    What I know so far:

    Pictures were taken on the 20th of September 1944 in the border town of Hamont, Belgium, crossing into Budel, Holland. The town was liberated in the morning of 20 September by the 1st batallion Suffolk regiment.
    I've found indication on IWM's website that the 3rd Royal Tank Regiment was in the town as well. Sadly this file is not available online. WD number of the tank: T148750. It was the east flank of the campaign so I'm guessing they are part of the 11th armoured division, but the logo on the front hull looks quite sloppy for a yellow square and bull...

    I'd be grateful if someone could point me in the right direction.

    Edit: mods, it seems i posted in the wrong thread. It should be in
    Searching for Someone & Military Genealogy
  2. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member


    From 3 RTR War Diary (WO171/866):

    20 September 1944
    0900 COs conference. Order of March C, Recce, CO’s tk, B carrying Mons, RHQ, A carrying Mons, 3 Mons less 2 coys, A1.
    1130 Bn moves.
    1150 Cross SP X rds 427961.
    1400 Reach HAMONT 4797.
    1530 Reach BUDEL 4999. Opposition which had been slight increases. Bazookas encountered and large numbers of enemy seen moving in woods NE of CL at 5001.
    1730 Efforts made to clear these woods, but it was decided to push on for SOERENDUNK 4902 before dark.
    1930 SOERENDUNK held firmly.
    2000 COs conference. RHQ 492027. Tomorrow MAARHEEZE to be captured. Move as follows:- 0730 hrs A Sqn with sub sub-unit of recce, and A Coy of Mons to work to SE. 0800 hrs C Sqn with C Coy of Mons move to loop road NORTH of MAARHEEZE. 0730 hrs B Sqn move direct down CL.

    From 3 Mons War Diary (WO171/1349):

    20 September 1944 WYCHMAEL
    Bn moved off. Crosses ESCAUT Canal at 3 (Br) Div bridgehead at LILLE-ST-HUBERT and crosses BELIUM/HOLLAND border. Bivouac night near SOERENDONK.

    I hope that helps.


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  3. FrankTheTank

    FrankTheTank New Member

    Thank you for your quick reply. This at least confirms the actions of 3RTR. I'm assuming "3 mons" is the Monmouthshire Regiment?

    Do the C, B and A refer to the squadrons? (I'm still getting used to British nomenclature.)
  4. idler

    idler GeneralList

    3 Mons were in 11 Armd Div and the troops in the picture appear to be wearing the 11 Armd Div flash - well, a light rectangle with a dark blob...
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  5. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    3 Mons would I believe be the 3rd Battalion of the Monmouthshire Regiment.
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  6. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian

    Nothing in Delaforce's Taming the Panzers, I'm afraid.
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  7. FrankTheTank

    FrankTheTank New Member

    Did the 1st batallion Suffolk regiment by any chance travel with an armoured unit or was that never the case? Most of their pictures only show carriers and light vehicles.
  8. FrankTheTank

    FrankTheTank New Member

    I found this in Patrick Delaforce's "The Black Bull":

    (...) On the night of the 20th, forward units were rearranged.

    The 3rd Royal Tank Regiment and 3rd Monmouthshire Regiment together with the 23rd Hussars and 8th Rifles came under the command of the 29th Brigade.

    The 2nd Fife and Forfarshire and 1st Herefordshire Light Infantry together with the 4th King's Shropshire Light Infantry and 15/19th Hussars came under command of 159th Brigade.

    29th Brigade was sent North and 159th towards Someren. (...)
  9. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    See - 3 RTR B Squadron
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