My father left me a set of tape recordings of his experiences in WW2, recorded on a cassette recorder when he was in his 60's. At the time I was a serving officer in the Royal Engineers and listened to them with interest, but without thought of trying to validate the historical facts. 25 years on and now retired I am researching the history and it is proving very difficult. I have the tapes, his service record and little else. My father enlisted in 1943 intending to join the East Surrey Regiment. After completing infantry training he was selected for driver training. After learning to drive a Bren Gun carrier he and a mate decided to volunteer for a new unit being formed under the REME cap badge to attack German Radar equipment. The tapes are not in historical order but record: his training landing in France by parachute before D-Day to attack a German Radar station two raids in Norway Working with the Dutch and French resistance Attacking a German airfield being taking prisoner and narrowly avoiding being shot as a special forces soldiers Fighting in the the winter of 44-45 in the Ardennes post war TA service in REME. Amongst his personal effects there is an SAS tie, which he told me they given in recognition of the nature of their operational service. The SAS regimental association has no records, no does the REME museum. The timing of the unit formation would suggest a response to the lessons of the Bruneval raid, but on several trips to the National Archive to find documented evidence have as yet drawn a blank. The tapes are short on names and dates. My father did not talk about the war or the SAS tie, although my childhood was spent watching WW2 every weekend on All Our Yesterday's. I only learned about the tapes as he recorded them, and the tie after he died. Intriguingly on the War Time memories web site there was a post about a Sgt ( formerly of the infantry, who had served in REME on raids to Norway against German radar stations. Like many of his generation my father was a modest man, but I have no reason to doubt the truth of his stories. The unit was only 170 strong according to my dad, and next of kin like me getting increasingly old, so the time to uncover more of the story from family records is very limited. It would be sad if the experiences of this unusual unit were to be lost in the fog of army records. I would be grateful for any suggestions or help in uncovering the history of his service. Thanks in advance. Daniel Jones
Daniel, An interesting puzzle to solve or at least make some headway. There are a few members here whose focus is special operations, so they may come along and comment. The REME aspect is logical for involvement in raiding - to acquire technical information and equipment samples. Have you tried Professor R.V. Jones book? He was director of scientific intelligence for the Air Ministry and wrote 'Most Secret War', available in many editions. There were only a few German radar stations before D-Day and earlier this year the topic appeared in a book - not to hand for the moment. Raiding Norway does seem odd. The best known sabotage raids being aimed at "heavy water" and are relatively well-known. It would help others if you could provide his full details: name, DoB, place of birth, Service Number.
Good morning and thank you for the prompt reply. In terms of the number of Radar stations before D-Day their was a German network that ran from Northern Norway all the way down to the coast of France. You are right to observe the need to capture equipment, that was a key role at the unit, which was organised into syndicates of 8 with two small trucks. The structure was a syndicate commander (Lt or Captain), Sgt, 2 drivers, demolition specialist, comms and radar techs. The syndicates were attached to REME workshops for pay, rations and vehicle support but operated independently, so from 1943 to 45 my father's service record shows a number of REME units. Towards the end of the war they were redeployed as infantry. I could post a lot of stuff here but perhaps it would be easier to share with only those who have an interest? I will track down the book you mention. I have "Churchill's Shadow Raiders" about the Bruneval raid and looking at how the raid went the unit is a logical response to the threat posed by German Radar.
Hi I watched a program on Sky History a while back looking in to the raids to gather German radar intelligence. They stated that a RAF radar engineering SNCO was commandeered for one mission. It was his job to locate the vital radar components and extract them whilst the rest of the team gave him protection. This would suggest to me that whoever had the right knowledge and experience and was available would have been the first choice for the mission as opposed to any specific Regiment/Corps. The REME stuff in Trux has many references to Radar WORKSHOPS s Hope this helps Gus
Hi Gus, Many thanks for responding. What were the raids covered in the Sky History programme and how did they work? Your description sounds like the Bruneva Raid described in the Damien Lewis book "Churchill's Shadow Raiders. In the run up to D-Day the allies had a clear need to neutralise or destroy German Radar installations and they also needed to continue gathering intelligence. The unit described by my father makes sense as a follow on building from the lessons of the Bruneval raid; a unit able to put boots on the ground behind enemy lines, capture useful materials and destroy the installations. REME had workshops in support of radar for field artillery, for example, but these were mechanics fixing the kit rather than special forces. Everything about my fathers account suggests that the REME cap badge was a flag of convenience that allowed the operations to remain inconspicuous. From what my father describes the raids were carefully targeted and always followed by an intelligence debrief. Best regards Daniel
Hi Daniel, Did his recollections include the transport arrangements for the raids in Norway? Could you post up the pages from his service record which show which units he was with and the dates? Regards Tom
Good morning Tom. He only provides partial information about how they went on the various raids. I think in one of the raids to Norway it was drop off by MTB and collection by aircraft. He records flying out of Norway in a Mosquito that then had to ditch but fortunately they were picked up by a Navy Corvette and taken back to Scotland, although he does not say where and may not have know. For D-Day they were originally going in by glider but this was changed at the last minute to a parachute drop. This is part of one of the transcripts: "Right. How we saw the Swedes. we were in Norway and we were being chased by Jerry's with dogs. Now if they're hunting you with dogs it's murder I mean if you kill the bloke, the handler, the dog runs loose. Norwegians said, no don't worry about that, you carry on. So we carried on, and also the two Swedish frontier guardsmen, they start sort of looking up in the sky, whistling away, not looking at anything, you know, everywhere but where we were, and we just went straight past them, and then they sort of got back to their own business. We went in about three or four hundred yards, turned and followed the frontier along. Norwegians said, don't worry, don't worry, we're all right. And then come up to another road, we went down there, there's the Swedish guards, and they all looked the other way and pretended to be doing something else, and we went across back into Norway. So we met the Swedes. Sometimes funny things happen. The Swedes were on the Norwegian side, and if they could turn their other eye, they would. Though they used to say some of the Americans on bombing missions turned towards Sweden deliberately and landed so they could get interned. Anyway, coming home, motor torpedo boat. Christ they don't half cork screw. Turned this way, that way and every way, and all the Navy thinks of is giving you a cup of kai, this is a thick cocoa made with chocolate, that's alright but it goes straight down and straight up again, then they said it was going to be transferred to a larger vessel and we meet a corvette and we get transferred. because we follow procedure I'm the last Joker, gets up top, one of these open air gits in the Navy, turns out to be the first officer, he looks at all of us and he said, ah well what we are, I'll give you a good cup of kai and you can get some rest. And I looked at him and I said, you can stick it up your jacksy. I think he nearly broke a blood vessel, never been spoken like it in his life. But the old man took him by the arm and he said, don't take notice of him, he's completely bloody bomb happy. He said, mad as a March hair, just ignore him. So that was that. " The service record is no help as far as I can tell because, as I say in the thread above. the syndicates were dispersed and simply attached to a convenient workshop for pay and rations, but were accommodated away from the REME unit. They wore a red patch behind their cap badge to differentiate them from the workshop. Here is what I have in terms of his service record and pay book. If you have any ideas about how to research further or any insights I would be really grateful. This is a link to the relavent part of dad's service record: Service and Casualty Form.pdf This is a link to the transcript of the first tape, which covers how he got into his unit and the training received. https://1drv.ms/b/s!AofurbWXvtfjj-hurV4FBqAKG0xYbg?e=0UxKlu Thanks for your interest. Daniel
Hi Daniel, Very interesting stuff. Is your fathers overseas service recorded anywhere in his Service Records? Kind regards Emps
Sorry, but I think he might have misremembered as it seems surprising to hear anyone able to fly out of occupied Norway in a Mosquito. That would need a proper runway surely. Should be relatively easy to chase up a lost Mosquito though so you might be able to track that down. Operations on the night before D Day have been intensively researched and all the transport squadron diaries are on line so that should be relatively easy to validate. His service record does record him embarking for the British Liberation Army from the UK in Jan 45 as part of 9 AA Workshop Company. That's also probably easy to check in the unit war diary. Regards Tom
Not my area, but didn't some streamlined Mosquitos do the trip to Sweden from the UK - carrying official dispatches and the occasional VIP?
For you Tom, and David. David has it re Mosquito flights and Sweden. Jack Byrne was flown in one from Sweden back to the UK (see "The General Salutes a Soldier), but, and stating the obvious, Sweden is not Norway. Brief precie re Jack Byrne pdf attached below. Kind regards, always, Jim.
Hi Daniel, Regarding: "For D-Day they were originally going in by glider but this was changed at the last minute to a parachute drop." Did he say anything about; - The time of the drop? - Which airfield they left from? - The nationality of the stick commander? - If an SOE operative joined them? - Or if he was with people from another unit / mixed in with, Pathfinders, RASC, HQ personnel, etc., on this drop? Post the the Arden was he part of the Rhine crossing at all? Best Regards, SH
Hi Tom I have reviewed the tape again - my mistake, it was a Wellington Bomber. You are right that a Mosquito was not a suitable aircraft. He mentions a Mosquito raid in Belgium in a later tape and I mixed the two aircraft up. Regards Daniel
Hi, sorry for the slow reply. He wasn't clear as all his operations were need to know. It was most likely D-1 and it would have been in the hours of darkness. No mention of SOE. The radar base they went to attack was well inland from Caen, most likely one of the 6 bases that the RAF had not managed to destroy. Several syndicates landed from his unit, each with the same mission of destroying a radar station and then waiting for the advance. His syndicate opted to head west towards the invasion and made it out. Not all made it back amongst those that stuck to the order to wait. Sometime in 1945 the unit was switched mostly to infantry work and he fought in Holland and into Germany. He mentions the Rhine crossing but it was not clear what his involvement was. I will have another look and see if I am missing something in response to your questions. Regards Daniel
Thanks. I have read up on the Bruneval raid and the R Jones book on the war against radar. Jones in his book states that after Bruneval there were a lot of proposals for further raids against radar, which would account for the creation of a specialist unit. He also states they learned pretty much all they needed from Bruneval in relation to German radar. In the plans for D-Day, air attack was the primary approach to destroying German raider. By the time D-Day launched it seems only 6 bases were still operating after sustained air attacks. I assume the targets of my father's unit were the working bases. After D-Day he went on a raid to Norway for a second time, and then seems to have served as in attacking key targets behind German lines e.g. airfields and the capture of key German equipment. I am still digging! regards Daniel
Thanks both. The aircraft was a Wellington, my mistake. Tom, Where on line to I look for the D-Day transport diaries? or indeed for the post D-day raid to Norway? Also where would I find the war diary? I am not optimistic about the war diaries as the attachment to a REME workshop seems to have been for pay and rations, but is worth a look. My assumption is that the unit was kept separate from REME in all other respects and controlled from within the 21st Army group. Any thoughts? Regards Daniel
It does not align well with the tapes. He has the medal for the campaign in Europe and there is an entry in his pay book, and various photographs, mementoes and contacts.
Hi Tom, I will do so shortly. I am trying to bring together my recent reading and the transposing of the tape transcripts - nearly finished!
