Remembering Today 19 July 1945. The crew and passengers of Liberator C.VII EW631

Discussion in 'The War In The Air' started by Peter Clare, Jul 19, 2012.

  1. Peter Clare

    Peter Clare Very Senior Member

    19 July 1945

    1315 Flt
    Liberator C.VII EW631

    On take-off, the aircraft struck a 15-18 feet high tree and crashed at Mascot, Sydney. It was destroyed by fire and all aboard were killed. The aircraft, bound for Momote on Manus Island mistakenly taxied on to runway 16 before being redirected to runway 22. After almost 15 minutes of engine checking the aircraft became airborne at 2005 hrs, the starboard wing clipped a pine tree before crashing into the viaduct of the Southern and Western Suburbs Sewer over Muddy Creek. The cause of the loss was not determined. Following the crash, a civilian; Gordon William Knowles, attempted to rescue those on board and for his bravery was awarded the George Medal. The citation for Mr Knowles award is reproduced below.

    Fatalities

    Squadron Leader Ivan St John RAYNER 29 Pilot
    Flying Officer Frank Fordon HILDRETH 33 RNZAF Co-Pilot
    Flying Officer Duncan MCNEE 31 Navigator
    Flight Sergeant Alexander Finlay STEVENSON Flight Engineer
    Flying Officer John Leonard TILL Wireless Operator
    Commander James Edward BASS 27 RNVR
    Lieutenant Commander Henry Peter BYRNE 31 RN
    Commander Leonard Evelyn Romaine GOVETT 37 RN
    Captain John Dwight HARVEY 45 RN
    Leading Steward Eric MORRIS 26 RN
    Surgeon Lieutenant Colin NOLAN 26 RNVR
    Captain James Gregson ROPER 44 OBE RN


    The citation for the award of the George Medal for Mr William Knowles.

    A Liberator aircraft with a complement of 12 crashed a short distance from Mascot airfield New South Wales, Australia, immediately after take-off. The fuselage finally came to rest beneath a viaduct and immediately burst into flames. Blazing petrol escaping from the damaged fuel tanks spread over the water in which the wreck was partially submerged, entirely surrounding it with an area of fire. Mr Knowles rushed to the scene and extricated one body from the wreckage and with some assistance succeeded in extricating two more. After the removal of the third body, Knowles was in such an exhausted condition as the result of burns, immersion and carbon monoxide poisoning that he collapsed and was taken to hospital. Mr Knowles showed courage and utter disregard for his own safety in his endeavor to save the lives of the victims.

    20 Feb 1946 - GEORGE MEDAL AWARD TO ROCKDALE RESIDENT. DRAGGED...

    Movement history of Liberator C.VII EW631

    Ex. 44-39258

    Delivered to Dorval 5 September 1944. Via Lagens to the UK arriving 11 September 1944. To Scottish Aviation Ltd and then 511 Squadron, Lyneham on 16 September 1944. To 246 Squadron 1 October 1944 and then to 1315 Flight. Hit trees after a night take-off from Sydney (Mascot) New South Wales, Australia on 19 July 1945. Crashed at North Brighton and destroyed by fire.
     
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  2. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    Thanks for this one - no RAAF personnel on board, so not part of the research I am conducting.

    What is interesting is that I can't find a mention of it on the ozatwar website, it has a brilliant section on military aircraft crashes in Australia during WW2 but this one doesn't appear.

    I will have another check to see if I am missing something obvious......
     
  3. spidge

    spidge RAAF RESEARCHER

    This is the list of those deaths who were buried in the Sydney War Cemetery.

    McNEE, DUNCAN Flying Officer 187280 19/07/1945 31 Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. B. 11. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    STEVENSON, ALEXANDER FINLAY Flight Sergeant 1570436 19/07/1945
    Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. B. 9. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    RAYNER, IVAN St. JOHN Squadron Leader 41531 19/07/1945 29 Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. B. 16. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    TILL, JOHN LEONARD Flying Officer 161364 19/07/1945 25 Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. B. 13. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    BASS, JAMES EDWARD Commander
    19/07/1945 27 Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. B. 1. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    GOVETT, LEONARD EVELYN ROMAINE Commander
    19/07/1945 37 Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. A. 3. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    NOLAN, COLM Surgeon Lieutenant
    19/07/1945 26 Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve United Kingdom 2Z. A. 6. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    BYRNE, HENRY PETER Lieut-Commander
    19/07/1945 31 Royal Navy United Kingdom 2Z. B. 3. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    MORRIS, ERIC Leading Steward P/LX.22687 19/07/1945 26 Royal Navy United Kingdom 2Z. B. 5. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    HARVEY, JOHN DWIGHT Captain
    19/07/1945 45 Royal Navy United Kingdom 2Z. A. 1. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    ROPER, JAMES GREGSON Captain
    19/07/1945 44 Royal Navy United Kingdom 2Z. B. 7. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY

    HILDRETH, FRANK FORDON Flying Officer 416117 19/07/1945 33 Royal New Zealand Air Force New Zealand 2Z. B. 15. SYDNEY WAR CEMETERY
     
  4. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    "This is the list of those deaths who were buried in the Sydney War Cemetery" - why didn't I think of that??

    I have images of the RAF / RNZAF graves from my visit last year -
     

    Attached Files:

  5. DaveB

    DaveB Very Senior Member

    For Peter Clare - is it OK for the info you provided to be placed onto the NSW aircraft crash list?

    Is your info from the Price of Peace book? Or another source???

    cheers


    Dave
     
  6. Peter Clare

    Peter Clare Very Senior Member

    For Peter Clare - is it OK for the info you provided to be placed onto the NSW aircraft crash list?

    Is your info from the Price of Peace book? Or another source???

    cheers

    Dave

    Dave,

    Some of the info does indeed come from The Price of Peace but not all. I have quite a few details re Liberator loss which have been collected over the years, in some cases from movement and loss cards and also other publications.

    I would think it would be OK to use the info giving credit in part to Colin Cummings.

    Regards
    Peter
     
  7. RAAFRadarAir

    RAAFRadarAir Junior Member

    Hi Fellas. Laurie Edward, Melbourne, Australia here.
    'Spidge' (Sparrow!!) re RAAF memorials, you may have this one already. I have recently researched a Dambuster from here, suburban Carlton. F/Lt Robert Norman Barlow. Their Lancaster hit high-tension wires and crashed on the 'way out' over Holland. The bomb, 'Upkeep', blew up. All were killed. The graves and headstones of Barlow and of and his crew are in the nearest service cemetery in that part of Holland. Their Lancaster was AJ-E (Easy). All details here:
    < http://www.warbirdsite.com/warbirdsite_com_Barlow.html >
    A heart-rending tribute from his wife on the headstone.
    I am in contact with his daughter here.
    Many more Barlow hits on Google with keywords 'RAAF Dambusters Barlow'.
    (Keywords minus 'Dambusters' brings up another Barlow lost in a Liberator crash in England.)
    Not directly relevant, but I was lucky enough, on a European self-drive, to find the grave(s) of the legendary leader, W/Cmdr. Guy Gibson and his final navigator. (S/Ldr. Jim Warwick). That also is a tragic story - there were thousands of them. I have photographs of myself at the grave-side up on my pages at VirtualTourist.com . At the small Dutch village of Steenbergen.
    I hope that info has been of interest and/or help. Laurie.
     
  8. spidge

    spidge RAAF RESEARCHER

    Hi Fellas. Laurie Edward, Melbourne, Australia here.
    'Spidge' (Sparrow!!) re RAAF memorials, you may have this one already. I have recently researched a Dambuster from here, suburban Carlton. F/Lt Robert Norman Barlow. Their Lancaster hit high-tension wires and crashed on the 'way out' over Holland. The bomb, 'Upkeep', blew up. All were killed. The graves and headstones of Barlow and of and his crew are in the nearest service cemetery in that part of Holland. Their Lancaster was AJ-E (Easy). All details here:
    < http://www.warbirdsite.com/warbirdsite_com_Barlow.html >
    A heart-rending tribute from his wife on the headstone.
    I am in contact with his daughter here.
    Many more Barlow hits on Google with keywords 'RAAF Dambusters Barlow'.
    (Keywords minus 'Dambusters' brings up another Barlow lost in a Liberator crash in England.)
    Not directly relevant, but I was lucky enough, on a European self-drive, to find the grave(s) of the legendary leader, W/Cmdr. Guy Gibson and his final navigator. (S/Ldr. Jim Warwick). That also is a tragic story - there were thousands of them. I have photographs of myself at the grave-side up on my pages at VirtualTourist.com . At the small Dutch village of Steenbergen.
    I hope that info has been of interest and/or help. Laurie.

    Hi Laurie,

    Thanks for the info.

    The contact with his daughter must have been interesting.

    There are a number of us on here from Melbourne.

    I do have all the grave headstones of the "Dambusters" crews who died as I commenced a thread on those who survived, as well as where/when they died after the raid on other ops and post war. Time allowances have seen it stall somewhat but I am determined to complete it when I can "afford" an Ancestry account. Tracking the final resting places will be another matter.

    Cheers

    Geoff
     
  9. K Roper

    K Roper New Member

    Hi
    I have just become a member of this forum and read this thread regarding the EW631 Liberator crash at Mascot Sydney with interest as Capt James Gregson Roper is my Paternal Grandfather.
    Does anyone have any further information regarding this accident?
    Thank you
    Kath
     
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  10. Thames

    Thames New Member

    Kath, Captain James Roper was my grandfather’s commanding officer in 1941. Somewhere I have a couple of letters from him to my family when my grandfather was killed in 1942. I have a lot of respect for Captain Roper having seen a bit of what he did, he and my grandfather got on very well. This sounds a very tragic accident.
     
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  11. K Roper

    K Roper New Member

    Hi Thames
    Great to hear from you, I am sorry for the loss of your Grandfather, 1941 would be HMS Ambrose in Dundee. I am very interested in any information you may have during this time as I am researching my Grandfather’s career in the Royal Navy. Kath
     
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