25th Dragoons Nominal Roll

Discussion in 'RAC & RTR' started by NikToo, Feb 16, 2011.

  1. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

  2. solidsilver

    solidsilver Member

    Thank you. I didn’t know such a service existed. I am new to this sort of thing
     
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  3. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

     
  4. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    Marcus, I've since found some buttons,which were my father's, but here's an interesting thing. They look exactly like 25th Dragoons, but are on very close scrutiny, 20th Lancers, an Indian tank regiment, which he never served in! I think it likely that they were also used unnoticed, as much finer quality and better shiny gilt in preference to the Indian manufactured 25D ones, by him and fellow officers.
     
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  5. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    In addition, from the Tank Museum, Bovington, you can apply for your grandfathers RAC Tracer Card, too.

    The Tank Museum | Enquiry Charges and Available Services

    If you pop in the search function ‘Tracer Card’ on this Forum, it will reveal what you receive for your money - I unfortunately don’t have immediate access to an example on my phone.

    I would thoroughly recommend attaining his TC.

    Best,

    Marcus
     
  6. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    Hi Richard,

    Capt. Burton, was wounded in action on February 15th, 1944, whilst his location known as “Ammunition Hill” was engaged by Japanese artillery fire during the Battle of the Admin Box.

    If I’m not mistaken his injuries were sustained when a shell directly exploded a munitions pile.

    In fact, I’m fairly certain there’s a mention of this account in Tom Grounds book.

    Then it would seem - date unknown - after this incident he was posted to 146 Regiment, RAC, (Duke of Wellington Regiment). I really need to look into this properly, but I suspect he was perhaps recuperating cum performing light duties at Pashau Camp in Poona.

    Possibly his duties involved a training role, as 146, Rgt, ‘B’ Sqd, were converting to Lee tanks at this time.

    Thereafter he served with the Royal Tank Regiment until retiring as a Major in 1952, succinctly put in the London Gazette: “retires on retired pay on account of disability.”

    • Note ‘from’ DWR and the subtitle RTR, I assume from this he’s now formally RTR on or around this date in 1944.
    D7D288E5-0B03-4D4C-8DBF-7FCFC72EA5A6.jpeg

    • Retirement notice
    9A62F877-8755-409C-83A0-7DD83D54C324.jpeg
     
  7. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    Richard,

    Would that be a C.W.D.W. Alexander?

    No, regrettably I don’t know which individual he could be in the photograph.

    Again, I don’t recognise any of the other officers either. It’s seldom I’ve come across any officer pictures to the 25D.

    I reckon with a bit of research and with the assistance of portrait and other photos, we could eventually establish a few names.

    You know, it’s very likely each individual in the photo had a copy, and you can bet someone named each man for posterity; I’ve seen it on other group photographs.
     
  8. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member


    It particulars like this that truly make my day - thank you.

    I concur with your assessment and deem this more than feasible, now to find a 20L officers gilt button for the collection.

    Out of interest what’s the diameter of the largest button you have, and is there a makers mark on the reverse?
     
  9. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    Before I forget, these are the Indian made slip-on shoulder titles.

    The top two pairs are officers slips devoid of the border. The khaki drill, jungle green and edged examples are other ranks patterns worn on the appropriate dress.

    A0B9163F-D4E0-480A-BC5D-4F5152DCD5BC.jpeg

    This pair of officer slips were stitched directly on the rank epaulettes, hence, a little tatty around the edges from their removal (not by me) and a moth has had a little nibble, too.

    44325B87-5EAA-4376-8F7E-54C6907DCE71.jpeg
     
  10. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    The button diameter is 20mm and no makers mark.
     
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  11. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    Hi Marcus, yes it's C.W.D.W. Alexander. He retired as Major Alexander, 3rd Dragoon Guards in 1958.
    It would be most interesting to fill in the gaps of those officers in the group.
     
  12. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    Here’s a 25D brass Bed/Duty-Plate to Tpr. J. Emerson of ‘A’ Squadron.

    I do intend to attain his Tracer Card - I’ve several other WRC projects on the go at the moment that take my time.
    50157BAE-31F4-4C06-BABE-220B84F05032.jpeg

    The central disc badge design, I thought likely to be a template of the large Indian made button to the 25D. However, I was incorrect, the largest button is smaller than the centre motif device.
    A4DA22D1-1135-4609-84B8-428135EB4CC1.jpeg
     
  13. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    That's amazing. What an incredibly rare item. Talking of beds,you've jogged my memory. My father often recalled a particular night when his tanks were out of harbour. A Jap attack to destroy the tanks was foiled as they were out, by complete coincidence, on a night patrol. One of the troopers left behind in the tank harbour was asleep in his bed, which was draped in a mosquito net. Someone prodded him when he was in a deep sleep. "B***er off, it's not my turn for guard duty!"he said, and then another prod. He turned and saw the ghostly figure of a Jap through the mosquito net, pointing a revolver at him. He screamed thinking at first it was a nightmare and sprang up, adrenaline racing, in an instant and the Jap fired, just creasing his temple, but he managed to get away and hide in the jungle until the tanks returned.As far as I know this isn't in any book and this is the first time I've related it.My father often yelled in his sleep years after the war and I wondered if it was this incident that remained ingrained in his subconscious memory. Could this bed tag be a souvenir of this incident? Probably not but we'll never know!
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2019
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  14. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    Major (temp) C.W.D.W Alexander is listed as Mentioned in Despatches in the 25th Dragoons Medal Awards.
     
  15. Marcus H

    Marcus H Member

    An amazing account, Richard. And, that’s what you would literally call a scrape with death - thank you for sharing this.

    That also reminds me, there’s a similar scenario written in ‘Some Letters from Burma’ on pages 105 & 106. Although, I suspect perhaps an unrelated incident to yours and without doubt one of many such probing attacks by the enemy.

    This is a picture of Cpl. Charles “Charlie” Fairweather, ‘A’ Squadron, mentioned in the documented encounter of a Japanese night attack on his location at around 0200 during the night of 5/6th February, 1944 - a L/Cpl at the time of this picture being taken.

    4748DBE3-1556-4260-B89E-613DCCA4163E.jpeg

    On his right arm, situated upon the single rank chevron you can just see his 25D NCOs arm badge.

    E001EC59-DD9A-4732-A29A-6A96A8A01735.jpeg

    Below, is Charlie’s actual metal (Indian made) NCO badge seen in the photo, now residing with distinction in my collection - it’s an utter privilege to be the custodian of such an item.

    B807E330-8E28-4FB7-9C19-F078D6F98A6D.jpeg

    Plus, a few more examples of the 25D NCO arm badge variations, including Charlie’s on the top row, far right.

    28226BE8-E498-4020-8526-86A05F79431C.jpeg
     
  16. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    Marcus, what an amazing collection. I've seen the odd 25D item on ebay, though some of it is modern. Somewhere I've got my father's cloth badge, but it has suffered from moth. I wonder if there was any Regimental silver, which would probably have been acquired in India. Thanks also for the pics of your various NCO arm badges and the one that was Charlie Fairweather's. Great that you have a photo of him wearing it.
     
  17. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

     
  18. richardmiles

    richardmiles Active Member

    Marcus, I've found reference to the incident on page 140 of John Leyin's book, "Tell Them Of Us". The man awoken by the Jap, was Trooper Collins, my father's batman.
     
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